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Xenon

Xenon All 3 Stats vs. Pure Stat

Hello Basil,

I was wondering since Xenon uses Str, Dex, and Luk, and it states that all 3 stats give you a boost, would it be better to go ahead and use all 3 of those stats or should you go Pure Luk for example? Which build would give you the best range output. I would prefer answers from people who have actually played Xenon in KMS tespia, but your thoughts/opinions are welcome as well.

December 23, 2012

55 Comments • Newest first

TickleMeChad

[quote=Jachy]Why da fudge are people talking about classes that won't be in GMS for about 6 months? >.<[/quote]

Because I would like to know ways to prepare for it, such as which stats would be most beneficial so I can work on funding.

Reply December 29, 2012
Jachy

Why da fudge are people talking about classes that won't be in GMS for about 6 months? >.<

Reply December 28, 2012
JETT4h1re

well things are gonna change alot so lets just wait till xenon comes out and then choose what to do with ur AP

Reply December 28, 2012
tecul1

And, with the current KMSt, you are FORCED to go all-stat if you auto-assign, which many of us will.

Reply December 28, 2012
Imaginal

@wahaha791: Actually Multilateral is Base Stat dependant...
Stats from equips won't activate it.

Reply December 27, 2012
Imaginal

[quote=wahaha791]After reaching 260 STR, DEX, and LUK, the choice to put your remainder AP depends on your funding. Getting %Single Stat is easier and cheaper than %All Stat, but %All Stat is clearly superior after taking stat bonuses from equipment into account. If you are not well funded, it'll be easier to just dump all your AP into LUK after the 260 stat requirements. Personally, I would continue to evenly distribute my AP, since the potential for growth is much greater than investing solely in one stat.[/quote]
Actually Xenon has been updated yet again so here's the update on "Multi-Lateral"
A new Multi-Lateral skill has been added at level 200 requiring 330 DEX,STR, LUK for full effect. Which mean Stats must be evenly distributed
leafre(dot)net/showthread.php?23574 "replace (dot) with .
Plus going pure stat wouldn't be a smart idea because you would be missing out of the extra % Damage from full effect. "Because of these changes"

Reply December 27, 2012
JETT4h1re

so just auto assign till u have 260 STR and 260 DEX and then pump the rest of ur ap points into LUK right? honestly XENON seems to be more interesting than i originally believed it to be wanna make it my main once it comes to gms

Reply December 27, 2012
mathgeek147

% all stat is the same as % main if they're all even. But, it's easier to get % main than % all. ex: if you have a 3% all stat item, but used it for % main, it'd probably get 6% main. So if you have 50% all stat, you could probably turn that into 70%+ main stat

Reply December 26, 2012
darkspawn980

[quote=mikealSin]It actually doesn't matter. Basically if you divide it into 3 stats, lets say you have 100% all stat and 300 str/dex/luk. This would net you +900 stat from all % gears. Now lets say you have 900 pure stat. 100% of that would also grant you +900. Going pure stat is the safest path.

Of course, the skill that give you more damage with all 3 past 150 (?) would give you 10% more damage but with today's equips you can have that while going pure stat. In the end it goes to cost and getting thief % Str seems the cheapest way to fund a Xenon. You do lose out the avoid granted from Luk tho so in truth the best is probably pure Luk.[/quote]
except the class specifies (and it's been proven) that you need 260 [b]AP[/b], +all stat from gears, skills and such don't grant the damage increases.

Reply December 26, 2012
puretppc

So Xenon is a Thief-based class?

Reply December 26, 2012
GreenyScott

Bottom line, you want to have at least 260 in each stat.

Reply December 26, 2012
Exumaii

STR affects stance, DEX affects status resistance, and LUK affects avoidability.

Reply December 26, 2012
kiue

Not sure if they posted but ill do it anyway.

If you do the math, which i dont want to type out, you can get a better result from using Stat% than % all stat. If it is possible to get 12% all stats 3 lined equips then the All stats will win but the thing is that they cant be made. It is much easier and better to get the other equips with Stat% then all stat

Reply December 26, 2012 - edited
darkspawn980

[quote=tyuli]Because all stat potentials are always 3% lower compared to the same tier on a single stat.[/quote]

not always* some gear that is commonly used isn't (except at legendary rank) akyrum rings, branch noses and racc masks don't fall into that level tier.

Reply December 24, 2012 - edited
tyuli

[quote=DecembersRain]10% of 999 on a main stat = 99 stats.
10% of 333 on all 3 stats = 99 stats. (333 x 3 is the same as 999..)
I'm not sure why you would put 9% on main, and 6% on all 3... of course 9% is higher than 6%. That sort of makes your opinion biased.[/quote]

Because all stat potentials are always 3% lower compared to the same tier on a single stat.

Reply December 24, 2012 - edited
darkspawn980

[quote=johny2toes]You do.
The main argument is whether after placing 250 points in STR and DEX and LUK are the remaining 264 points you receive better placed in one single stat or split up. It's had a mix of arguments between getting higher single stat % then all stat (12% vs 9%) to... which most people have ignored the fact that +stat from gear makes the all stat route even more beneficial then it already is.[/quote]

could have sworn it was simply wether if you wanted to go 999, or divide it amongst all stats.

anyways, the best way to divide it is to go 260 str, 260 dex, rest on luck, this will give you the 50% damage, and having a higher luck value increases your avoid, while dex (which gives accuracy, lol) and str (gives def, you don't want to get hit anyways) are pretty much useless after the 260 cap.

and indeed, the above 260/260/4xx goes best with %all stat.

Reply December 24, 2012 - edited
Chirnobyl

[quote=DecembersRain]10% of 999 on a main stat = 99 stats.
10% of 333 on all 3 stats = 99 stats. (333 x 3 is the same as 999..)
I'm not sure why you would put 9% on main, and 6% on all 3... of course 9% is higher than 6%. That sort of makes your opinion biased.[/quote]
I believe it's because if you have Unique potential, you can either get 9% single stat or 6% all stat

Reply December 24, 2012 - edited
johny2toes

[quote=shadowind7]but... Xenon gets Multiartle or w/e. +40% total damage if you get the 1~4th job ones and have 250 in all i think [/quote]

You do.
The main argument is whether after placing 250 points in STR and DEX and LUK are the remaining 264 points you receive better placed in one single stat or split up. It's had a mix of arguments between getting higher single stat % then all stat (12% vs 9%) to... which most people have ignored the fact that +stat from gear makes the all stat route even more beneficial then it already is.

Reply December 24, 2012 - edited
TheMightBlad3r

Wait Wait Wait Wait WAIT.

Now say this....
You DO pump it all into onestat, lets say.....
1000 luk
4 xxx
4 xxx
4 xxx

Now lets say you do this.
333 xxx
333 xxx
333 xxx
4 xxx

Shouldn't all stat% be just as beneficial as % luk would be in the first build, because of the fact that you have three times the amount? If anything, it seems like it would be MORE useful

Reply December 24, 2012 - edited
Catastrophe

@darkspawn980: Lol. It was my fault for looking like I was trying to pick a fight with you, haha. I didn't have any intention of that, and I only realized that after I hit submit on my first comment.

Reply December 24, 2012 - edited
Catastrophe

@darkspawn980: Alright, i'm sorry, I guess I misunderstood you. At least we're on the same page, haha.

Reply December 24, 2012 - edited
shadowind7

but... Xenon gets Multiartle or w/e. +40% total damage if you get the 1~4th job ones and have 250 in all i think

Reply December 24, 2012 - edited
darkspawn980

@Catastrophe: my english fails at times, troublesome but it's not my main language -shrugs-

if you read the quote you just... well, quoted though, you'd notice i didn't mention any equips at all, just a base AP and % gear, so i don't see why you added equips and then proceeded to insult me for not taking them into account, i was just showing him he was wrong thinking that 50% all stats would equal 150% stat on a pure.

Reply December 24, 2012 - edited
Catastrophe

@darkspawn980:

... What? You were arguing the whole time that having a single % stat is better (when ignoring Xenon specific skills that give additional damage for having even stats).

[quote=darkspawn980]
on that same note, if you have a xenon with 333 on luk dex and str, and another with 999 luk, if you give the first one 50% all stats and the second one 50% luk, they would BOTH increase the same amount in both damage and range and whatnot, making getting %stat better than %all stat, since %all stat gives less %per line.[/quote]

You never mentioned that you were ignoring equipment that didn't give + all stats you imbecile. Rather than my reading comprehension, you should work on your writing - which is completely unreadable in some cases.

Reply December 24, 2012 - edited
darkspawn980

@Catastrophe: i didn't ignore it, what part of "i'm on your side" is hard to pick from my posts? it's obvious to anyone with half a brain that xenon gets some of the best stat bonuses from gear than any other class, +3 all stat scroll? that's 9 main stat for xenon, 25 all CHTP? that's 75 main stat, etc and etc and etc, i don't even see how it's related to math, it's plain dumb logic. i didn't even quote you so why the attitude? my post was adressing that if you look only at raw stats, getting %stat gear is indeed better, this was ignoring all the skills xenon has that increase damage for varied AP, and all the equips that have allstats.

so much for your reading comprehension

Reply December 24, 2012 - edited
Catastrophe

[quote=darkspawn980]@johny2toes: i'll be blunt, you're being retarded, they're the same formula, distributive property, you need a refresher on it.

4*(a+b+c) is the same as 4*a+4*b+4*c, don't want to believe me?

4*(2+3+4)
4*(9)
36

4*2+4*3+4*4
8+12+16
36

look at that, SAME THING.

on that same note, if you have a xenon with 333 on luk dex and str, and another with 999 luk, if you give the first one 50% all stats and the second one 50% luk, they would BOTH increase the same amount in both damage and range and whatnot, making getting %stat better than %all stat, since %all stat gives less %per line.

the ONLY reason why everyone should go %all stats and dump 260-260-494, is because of multilateral skill, which grants 50% damage if you have 260 AP in all three stats.[/quote]

You ignored my point on Tyrant equipment. Even if you ignore Xenon's specific skills that benefit you for raising all three stats equally, Tyrant equipment would greatly benefit % all stats making going single stat meaningless.

So much for your fortitude in math.

Reply December 23, 2012 - edited
darkspawn980

@johny2toes: i'm not forgetting it, was saying that the MAIN (<correct word this time) reason to use all stats is because of the 50% damage bonus. and even if i planned to drop posichaos on all my gear for extra attack, i'd also dump a 20% event scroll that gives 3 all stats, it would make the posichaos that much more powerful, especially on items that any char can use like masks and noses.

Reply December 23, 2012 - edited
xkillo32

u guys are all dumb
check out his skills
and u can see that theres a passive skill for each job advancement that makes ur dmg go up by 10% if ur stats(luk,dex,str) are a certain number or above

Reply December 23, 2012 - edited
johny2toes

@darkspawn980: You're forgetting about equipment still.
All stat % is better when you factor in +stat bonuses from equipment. Unless you don't plan on +all stat gear which is.. senseless in it's own. Unless you're funded enough to chaos of goodness every piece of your equipment for W.Atk and forget +stat all together.

Reply December 23, 2012 - edited
darkspawn980

@johny2toes: i'll be blunt, you're being retarded, they're the same formula, distributive property, you need a refresher on it.

4*(a+b+c) is the same as 4*a+4*b+4*c, don't want to believe me?

4*(2+3+4)
4*(9)
36

4*2+4*3+4*4
8+12+16
36

look at that, SAME THING.

on that same note, if you have a xenon with 333 on luk dex and str, and another with 999 luk, if you give the first one 50% all stats and the second one 50% luk, they would BOTH increase the same amount in both damage and range and whatnot, making getting %stat better than %all stat, since %all stat gives less %per line.

the ONLY reason why everyone should go %all stats and dump 260-260-494, is because of multilateral skill, which grants 50% damage if you have 260 AP in all three stats.

Reply December 23, 2012 - edited
Catastrophe

% All stat would be much more beneficial for rich players because equipment such as Tyrant gives you +150 ~ 200 to EVERY stat. Multiply that by 4 pieces of Tyrant equipment as well as other equipment that give you stats to every ability, and you already have around 1.3k to STR, DEX, and LUK at level 200.

Now, if you have 400% potential to all stats, you have the equivalent of 12k in a single stat.

So all stat wins in the end.

Reply December 23, 2012 - edited
Iknowall

[quote=iliektotroll]Distributive property sir. And you forgot to put attack into my formula.

+ I skipped 1 year in math, almost passed aime (that's 500 people nationwide)[/quote]

He sucks at math AND he can't read lol.

Reply December 23, 2012 - edited
johny2toes

@Iknowall: I feel sorry for your math skills then of you obviously can't see the difference between the dmg formula he posted and mine
Here take a closer look.

His: x attack ((4 * str + 4* dex + 4* luk)/100)
^ False dmg formula
One I posted: 1.5*(4*(STR+LUK+DEX))*ATT/100

Let's try this once more even closer
1.5*(4*STR+4*DEX+4*LUK)/100
1.5*(4*(STR+LUK+DEX))*ATT/100

Reply December 23, 2012 - edited
Iknowall

[quote=johny2toes]@Iknowall: He said a completely different dmg formula which is false.

@PeaBucket: So? You're just agreeing with the point I've been saying this whole time. All 3 are better then a single stat.
Between the same percentage + bonuses from equipment there is no reason to do single stat over all stat%.[/quote]

What you just said has made me conclude that you fail in math and that no one in this thread should listen to you.

Reply December 23, 2012 - edited
johny2toes

@Iknowall: He said a completely different dmg formula which is false.

@PeaBucket: So? You're just agreeing with the point I've been saying this whole time. All 3 are better then a single stat.
Between the same percentage + bonuses from equipment there is no reason to do single stat over all stat%.

Reply December 23, 2012 - edited
Iknowall

[quote=johny2toes]@iliektotroll: Where in the world did you get that from?
Xenon's damage formula is 1.5*(4*(STR+LUK+DEX))*ATT/100
Str/Luk/Dex are all equal.[/quote]

Wtf. You just said the exact thing @iliektotroll said.

Reply December 23, 2012 - edited
PeaBucket

[quote=johny2toes]1 stat is not better.
For one you have to account for the price as I already stated.
Whether you put 300 in all 3 stats or 900 in one you're going to have the same out-come whether it's 50% all stat or 150% single stat.
50% all stat is cheaper then 150% in a single stat thus already being better.

Next up you have to account for EQUIPMENT... Most equipment adds more then just 1 stat. It also adds the classes secondary.
My Luminous for example has +311 Luk from equipment.

If my Xenon has +300 in either stat other then that single one you pump all that AP into... all stat% would be better. And for most cases it will happen.

Granted it's the same base wise but when you account equipment nothing is going to over shadow allstat%.

The only reason you should do single stat is if you already have a very high amount of one specific stat.[/quote]

you need to read the other responses, people have said at least three times now that 50% allstat is the same as 50% 1 stat. I'll post the example again below.

50% LUK

999 + 499

50% allstat

LUK: 333 + 166
STR: 333 + 166
DEX: 333 + 166

Reply December 23, 2012 - edited
tyuli

9% main stat on 999 str = ~90 stat points
or 6% all stat on 333 str, dex, luk = ~60 stat points
Funny enough concentrating on one attribute gives more stat points.

Reply December 23, 2012 - edited
johny2toes

@iliektotroll: Where in the world did you get that from?
Xenon's damage formula is 1.5*(4*(STR+LUK+DEX))*ATT/100
Str/Luk/Dex are all equal.

Reply December 23, 2012 - edited
xkillo32

@TickleMeChad
every joob adv u get a skill to increase ur dmg by 10% if all ur stats are above a certain number
i meant luk,dex,str

Reply December 23, 2012 - edited
screwriod

What @johny2toes said

one stat is not better
you need all 3 of them because they give benefiticial to the stats

which is why all stats is nesecessary not only a pure luk would do it
but dex and str is important too

but i think most players would go for pure luk because of avoid

Reply December 23, 2012 - edited
x1mmortality

@DavidLe: Oh, right. Guess I didn't think it through. That makes sense xD.

Reply December 23, 2012 - edited
johny2toes

[quote=sillyray]You guys never considered that for %all stat to work, you would have to add ~333 to each stat instead of 995 to one. Now, like @Miauri said, %one stat would be way more beneficial because it can be higher.
In the end you are still going to add the same amount of SP so %one stat is better.
Edit: Sorry, I meant AP.[/quote]

1 stat is not better.
For one you have to account for the price as I already stated.
Whether you put 300 in all 3 stats or 900 in one you're going to have the same out-come whether it's 50% all stat or 150% single stat.
50% all stat is cheaper then 150% in a single stat thus already being better.

Next up you have to account for EQUIPMENT... Most equipment adds more then just 1 stat. It also adds the classes secondary.
My Luminous for example has +311 Luk from equipment.

If my Xenon has +300 in either stat other then that single one you pump all that AP into... all stat% would be better. And for most cases it will happen.

Granted it's the same base wise but when you account equipment nothing is going to over shadow allstat%.

The only reason you should do single stat is if you already have a very high amount of one specific stat.

Reply December 23, 2012 - edited
DavidLe

[quote=x1mmortality]This would be one hell of an OP class then... if those super rich people funded it with ~400%All, that's basically 1200%stat. Hopefully, they have low % attacks.[/quote]

this is wrong % all-stats only helpful with stats on equipment's
but for AP it doesn't matter how you split it up it will still be
total up the same as just putting it all into one stats

Reply December 23, 2012 - edited
sillyray

You guys never considered that for %all stat to work, you would have to add ~333 to each stat instead of 995 to one. Now, like @Miauri said, %one stat would be way more beneficial because it can be higher.
In the end you are still going to add the same amount of SP so %one stat is better.
Edit: Sorry, I meant AP.

Reply December 23, 2012 - edited
hamdeamon

It is possible I feel that if you go pure str, you have high damage but a really wild range.
Pure luk/dex i feel would be equal damage and maybe strong I don't know.

Reply December 23, 2012 - edited
twopointonefour

Well you're by default going to be having 250 base STR/DEX/LUK if you want to have the passive effect you in any shape or form.

And yes, %allstat is the best stat for Xenon.

Reply December 23, 2012 - edited
TickleMeChad

[quote=x1mmortality]This would be one hell of an OP class then... if those super rich people funded it with ~400%All, that's basically 1200%stat. Hopefully, they have low % attacks.[/quote]

Their skills are already posted on Orange Mushroom Blog.

Click this link to see their skills from Tespia -
http://orangemushroom.wordpress.com/2012/12/17/kmst-ver-1-2-460-xenon/#more-5113

Click this link to see their skill changes from Tespia to the Real KMS Server -
http://orangemushroom.wordpress.com/2012/12/22/kmst-ver-1-2-461-xenon-skill-changes/#more-5287

Reply December 23, 2012 - edited
x1mmortality

This would be one hell of an OP class then... if those super rich people funded it with ~400%All, that's basically 1200%stat. Hopefully, they have low % attacks.

Reply December 23, 2012 - edited
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