General

I'm not sure how i feel about flame orb being maxed seeing as it won't be used much after 2nd job I don't think.

3rd job I agree that buffs/passives that increase damage should be maxed first.
4th job I think Ifrit should be maxed immediately after buff mastery because of the mastery that it gives. And I would max arcane aim sooner as well, since it gives a huge boost.

[quote=IImaplers]Another thing to note is the emergence of Elemental Adapting; which would already prevent a lot of seduces, unless I'm mistaken.[/quote]

Yeah, that's true.

@Green4EVER: In the case of trying them out with friends, I see your point; even though cleansing pots do the job there just as well. I'll probably put out a bossing build which maxes HW a bit earlier.

Another thing to note is the emergence of Elemental Adapting; which would already prevent a lot of seduces, unless I'm mistaken.

[quote=IImaplers]Please elaborate. Most people will not be trying bosses that seduce heavily until around the 150's. If you're talking about Hilla, her seduces aren't deadly and only last a few seconds unlike the harder bosses.[/quote]

I don't disagree with him. The quest is a bit of an annoyance, but I don't see how putting 1 point in it could be harmful. It could be a lifesaver if you wanted to try out something like Horntail or Chaos Zakum with some friends even.

[quote=coolbreeze69]I'd suggest getting Heros Will long before the end of 4th job skills it really does come in handy[/quote]
Please elaborate. Most people will not be trying bosses that seduce heavily until around the 150's. If you're talking about Hilla, her seduces aren't deadly and only last a few seconds unlike the harder bosses.

I'd suggest getting Heros Will long before the end of 4th job skills it really does come in handy

[quote=Osage]whens red come out?[/quote] My guess is around november-december.
[quote=Osage]will i need to rebuild my F/P mage?[/quote] You'll only have to redo your skill points since certain skills are getting adjustments and there are going to be new skills replacing old ones.
[quote=Osage]will i need to rebuy mastery books?[/quote] Nope. If you've already used Paralyze 20/30 you probably won't have to use it again.
[quote=Osage]sorry if this is off topic.[/quote]No problem . I'm happy to answer your questions.

@ClericBoyZ15: Thanks. I'll definitely make a few more changes based on your suggestions.

Yeah, the MW/MS/INF debate got me thinking. For me personally, I love Infinity because I've got 44% buff duration increase and that adds 17 seconds to my Infinity, but for other and especially those who don't boss often, Meteor may prove a lot more useful.

[quote=scrumble]Personally, I think a Final Attack will be more usefull than Infinity, because its a fairly consistent DPS increase, whereas Infinity will be a short period of high damage. Maple Warrior will be a nice damage increase, but I think its debatable when it comes down to which one increases your DPS more. Personally, I think MW should come before Meteor Shower because you'll only have to cast MW once every 15 minutes, whereas Meteor Shower will need consistent attention on when you can cast it again and the cast time is pretty long. Besides, the damage it deals shouldnt be much more than 200% of your range, right? If look at it like that, it just seems more of a good bonus to deal some extra damage whereas Maple Warrior is a usefull buff, not just for the caster but for the party.
Having said that, I think its possible that when you train in a party, others will have MW 30 anyways. So if you're fond of party training, I think its possible to pick Meteor Shower before Maple Warrior.
I think this is pretty situational.

Just sharing my thoughts! Perhaps it'll help... somehow..

That would be just plain stupid, in my opinion. Giving every other book practically away except for one.[/quote]

I think MW>MS is still debatable. MS had it's cast time cut in half (around half) and had it's damage almost doubled. Not only that but the FA effect will work with amp (it shows up in range now) and if it works with AA and burning magic it would be well over 200%.
200*1.5*1.4*1.2=504.

@tecul1 MW30 doesn't even work Post-RED. there's only "Mastery Book 30" which will raise a skill of your choice. old Mastery books don't work and can be traded in for the new, general purpose ones

[quote=IImaplers]That's true. I moved Infinity to be after Ifrit because Ifrit will seem to have a greater impact on damage. Only the people with about 300k range will be able to complete dojo, and Infinity will be crucial for that (more so for its stance and HP recovery than damage). But how many people would have 300k range at lvl 15x anyway? Probably very very few, so you're right.

The next question is which takes precedence over which else in the general 4th job build... Infinity vs. MW vs. Meteor.

Should I also make an "Bossing Asap" build? I'm thinking Infinity would go a lot earlier for that, as well as Ifrit and Hero's Will.[/quote]

Personally, I think a Final Attack will be more usefull than Infinity, because its a fairly consistent DPS increase, whereas Infinity will be a short period of high damage. Maple Warrior will be a nice damage increase, but I think its debatable when it comes down to which one increases your DPS more. Personally, I think MW should come before Meteor Shower because you'll only have to cast MW once every 15 minutes, whereas Meteor Shower will need consistent attention on when you can cast it again and the cast time is pretty long. Besides, the damage it deals shouldnt be much more than 200% of your range, right? If look at it like that, it just seems more of a good bonus to deal some extra damage whereas Maple Warrior is a usefull buff, not just for the caster but for the party.
Having said that, I think its possible that when you train in a party, others will have MW 30 anyways. So if you're fond of party training, I think its possible to pick Meteor Shower before Maple Warrior.
I think this is pretty situational.

Just sharing my thoughts! Perhaps it'll help... somehow..

[quote=tecul1]I heard that MW wasn't obtainable from those books.[/quote]

That would be just plain stupid, in my opinion. Giving every other book practically away except for one.

@tecul1: Well that would just blow xP

I heard that MW wasn't obtainable from those books.

@IImaplers: It would be a good idea, since some people fund their characters from early levels. I'm really not sure if Meteor is better then MW though. No real way for us to test it out until RED comes.

[quote=wizardq]@IImaplers: Maybe push back infinity a bit? I say that for the most part since you don't really need any crazy burst in that level range (14x-15x) since you will be doing for the most part evo world or regular training spots, so you will 1hit everything anyway. You don't really get that serious with bossing until higher levels, so it wouldn't have much of an impact on how you do once you start seriously bossing.[/quote]

That's true. I moved Infinity to be after Ifrit because Ifrit will seem to have a greater impact on damage. Only the people with about 300k range will be able to complete dojo, and Infinity will be crucial for that (more so for its stance and HP recovery than damage). But how many people would have 300k range at lvl 15x anyway? Probably very very few, so you're right.

The next question is which takes precedence over which else in the general 4th job build... Infinity vs. MW vs. Meteor.

Should I also make an "Bossing Asap" build? I'm thinking Infinity would go a lot earlier for that, as well as Ifrit and Hero's Will.

@IImaplers: Maybe push back infinity a bit? I say that for the most part since you don't really need any crazy burst in that level range (14x-15x) since you will be doing for the most part evo world or regular training spots, so you will 1hit everything anyway. You don't really get that serious with bossing until higher levels, so it wouldn't have much of an impact on how you do once you start seriously bossing.

@Sungoon: Yeah, I'm basing my builds from what southperry says. I think I'll move Mana Burn to be maxed after Explosion instead of before, unless there are any objections. That 50% increase to damage looks so eye-popping until you read that there's only a 10% chance. And who knows whether that's by hit or by attack. Thanks for the suggestions. I'm sure you're already pondering genius post-RED builds as well filled with ideas I could only hope to grasp. I'd love to see them . Two opinions are better than one.

@GoXDS: *facepalm* How could I forget that MW 20/30 will be cheap to obtain when the RED patch comes. Also, I agree about Ele Decrease. I didn't realize it would be more useful earlier than ele adapting (was thinking boss-wise but it obviously has some use against non-bosses too). Thanks~

@IImaplers also remember that Mastery Books are dirt cheap post-red since you can buy a general purpose Mastery Book 20 and 30 after RED and old Mastery Books are useless (but can be traded for said Mastery Books). 20 is 7m and 30 is 10m iirc EDIT: this is in response to your MW comment
very, very minor but switch Elemental Decrease and Elemental Adapting? Decrease would max faster and would allow people to go unimpeded at resistant Monsters without resorting to different attacks. anything 100- don't really Status you nor does dmg against you really matter and both skills are pretty negligible but just my two cents

[quote=IImaplers]Thanks guys. I love the feedback and constructive criticism. MOAR please I'll have to do some re-adjusting.

One other thing is that I'm not sure if Mana Burn is that great of a skill that it should get maxed before Explosion is maxed. I mean, Mana Burn has a 10% chance to activate and also depends on how much MP a monster has left (how the heck do we know when a monster has less than 20% MP remaining anyway? lol).[/quote]

The many translations for Mana Burn have me confused, but I'm going off of what SouthPerry says o.o It's a 10% chance to deal 50% extra damage that ignores (?) defenses at max level... So I think it's more useful in a bossing situation. In my opinion, people who want to use the Fire Build would normally be more capable of 1-2 hit KOing enemies (if they normally can't, the Poison build is more logical to follow). So in this case, I think you can ignore the 20% MP requirement (It would only be a problem if you've activated MP Eater 7~8 times). And I think the 10% chance to deal 50% damage is kinda useless in training situations for this kind of person as well.

Hope that made sense

Thanks guys. I love the feedback and constructive criticism. MOAR please I'll have to do some re-adjusting.

One other thing is that I'm not sure if Mana Burn is that great of a skill that it should get maxed before Explosion is maxed. I mean, Mana Burn has a 10% chance to activate and also depends on how much MP a monster has left (how the heck do we know when a monster has less than 20% MP remaining anyway? lol).

[quote=IImaplers]Thanks a ton Arber .

-About the drains, does it take up your SP though if it indeed is already put in when you advance? If it doesn't then this means we get an extra point to use xD.

-For 2nd job, maxing meditation sooner would also mean you'd have to put in 3 MPE as a prerequisite, basically 3 wasted sp in my book. Also, medi is 20 sp, while pb is only 10. Those are a few reasons I held back on it and max pb and high wisdom beforehand. I'm not the best at calculating magic attack versus % skill damage. It would be great if you can elaborate how much more effective for PB's damage it would be to raise 10 sp for meditation rather than raise 9 sp for PB. From the looks of it, it seems negligible. I could be insanely wrong though.

-For 4th job, 1 point in meteor gives a 2% activation rate for FA. That seems pretty insignificant to me. It would also come as a disruption of the chain of ME setup to recast every 45 seconds. However, I think maybe it should go earlier?[/quote]

I'm not certain, but I'm pretty sure Elemental and Fervent Drain do not take up any advancement SP
And beautiful job as always <3

[quote=wizardq]For third job I think slime virus should be farther down the line. I could see it being useful, but I still think arcane overdrive takes priority. Maybe push mist down a spot too, since I personally didn't use it much except for fending off KS-ers.

Edit: For second job, I think maxing meditation sooner would give you a higher damage boost then maxing poison breath that soon, especially since we have so little magic attack at lower levels. I don't think the drain skill even requires a point to be put in it, I heard it is automatically there already when you advance.

Edit2: my bad, I just saw you separated the 3rd job builds into poison and fire, disregard what I said about 3rd job haha.

Edit3: For fourth job, it would make sense to put in one point into meteor shower early because of the FA effect it has while on cooldown. Since it would only be at 1 you would only have to recast once every minute or so.[/quote]

Thanks a ton Arber .

-About the drains, does it take up your SP though if it indeed is already put in when you advance? If it doesn't then this means we get an extra point to use xD.

-For 2nd job, maxing meditation sooner would also mean you'd have to put in 3 MPE as a prerequisite, basically 3 wasted sp in my book. Also, medi is 20 sp, while pb is only 10. Those are a few reasons I held back on it and max pb and high wisdom beforehand. I'm not the best at calculating magic attack versus % skill damage. It would be great if you can elaborate how much more effective for PB's damage it would be to raise 10 sp for meditation rather than raise 9 sp for PB. From the looks of it, it seems negligible. I could be insanely wrong though.

-For 4th job, 1 point in meteor gives a 2% activation rate for FA. That seems pretty insignificant to me. It would also come as a disruption of the chain of ME setup to recast every 45 seconds. However, I think maybe it should go earlier?

[quote=wizardq]For third job I think slime virus should be farther down the line. I could see it being useful, but I still think arcane overdrive takes priority. Maybe push mist down a spot too, since I personally didn't use it much except for fending off KS-ers.

Edit: For second job, I think maxing meditation sooner would give you a higher damage boost then maxing poison breath that soon, especially since we have so little magic attack at lower levels. I don't think the drain skill even requires a point to be put in it, I heard it is automatically there already when you advance.

Edit2: my bad, I just saw you separated the 3rd job builds into poison and fire, disregard what I said about 3rd job haha.

Edit3: For fourth job, it would make sense to put in one point into meteor shower early because of the FA effect it has while on cooldown. Since it would only be at 1 you would only have to recast once every minute or so.[/quote]

As far as Meteor Shower goes, the cool down is the same at every level. Nexon did this so that players wouldn't do what you said

For Poison Breath, the damage increases by 10% for each level. With Meditation, Lv. 1 gives a boost of 11 M.Atk and increases by 1 every level. So, I think it makes more sense to put points into PB before Medi for damage.

For third job I think slime virus should be farther down the line. I could see it being useful, but I still think arcane overdrive takes priority. Maybe push mist down a spot too, since I personally didn't use it much except for fending off KS-ers.

Edit: For second job, I think maxing meditation sooner would give you a higher damage boost then maxing poison breath that soon, especially since we have so little magic attack at lower levels. I don't think the drain skill even requires a point to be put in it, I heard it is automatically there already when you advance.

Edit2: my bad, I just saw you separated the 3rd job builds into poison and fire, disregard what I said about 3rd job haha.

Edit3: For fourth job, it would make sense to put in one point into meteor shower early because of the FA effect it has while on cooldown. Since it would only be at 1 you would only have to recast once every minute or so.

[quote=EpikSnow]As of now, no. I would like to make a FP but i'm foreign to the play style and skills.[/quote]
You may want to check this amazing guide out to learn what the F/P play style is like: http://www.basilmarket.com/forum/2717900

[quote=IImaplers]The explanations and reasoning will come. Any particular build you want to know the reasoning behind or should I explain all of them?[/quote]

As of now, no. I would like to make a FP but i'm foreign to the play style and skills.

[quote=EpikSnow]Wheres your reasoning behind this build?[/quote]
The explanations and reasoning will come. Any particular build you want to know the reasoning behind or should I explain all of them?

Wheres your reasoning behind this build?