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Srurtuphr

Hayato revamp patch notes

Discuss.
Personally I found our shinsoku was massacred. What's the point of even having it now with all the new 1v1 skills?
Also maybe I just didn't read carefully but it would seem a lot of our passive buffs such as to crit rate were completely removed.

0 October 7, 2015

14 Comments • Newest first

ulieq

Has anyone done a shinsoku (with 3 hypers) vs. rai blade flash dps breakdown yet?

Reply February 23, 2016
BenGarrison

This is a bit late but I have been playing hayato on reboot and it's easily the most fun I have had playing this game in a long time, especially since you can do stuff like in the previously linked videos and this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dod2L6OYE4U

Reply December 22, 2015
DeeeMon

Some time has passed by now, so here are my own personal thoughts about the skill changes.

First things first, about the Quick Draw stance. I didn't want to use the basic stance because I'm too obsessive about critical rate, but after using Hitokiri Strike while in the basic stance, I still have a pretty high crit rate, 85%. I'm actually okay with that, I will use both basic and Quick Draw stances for their certain situations.

Summer Rain/Hitokiri Hundred Strike, it's a great skill, for being a sort of ultimate attack and for giving a damage buff. I am able to maintain the buff while both mobbing and bossing in the different stances. I'm glad I can use this skill without worrying about that long cooldown from before the skill changes.

Master of Blades, well of course, everyone likes the much more improved mastery and stabler damage.

Battoujutsu Leap/Battoujutsu Dash, I don't find myself using this very often. Hayato already has a lot of mobility from attacking skills, so I always forget about this. I probably have to practice some more.

Battoujutsu Advance, I can't really use this skill properly, maybe because of lag or ping or whatever it is. It's just like Careening Dance for Dawn Warriors, it's too hard to do the full chain of attacks... I just don't use it at all, the duration of the buff is just too short to be bothered with.

Surging Blade, Center Ki, Shouryuusen, same as before.

Rising Slash, well doesn't this look like Thunder Breaker's Shark Sweep? It also lifts enemies in the air like Shouryuusen. I guess it has better vertical range. I haven't gone inside Romeo and Juliet PQ, but maybe it's useful to reach those two platforms while on the bottom ground.

Military Might, Vapor Blade, Katana Booster, Unfaltering Blade, Falcon Dive(will explain more later), same as before.

Whirlwind Cut, it feels faster.

Willow Dodge, I like how often it activates the damage boost now, it's a much needed improvement, helps a lot.

Everything else in third job, same as before. However, I do like how Dankuusen is in 3rd job now. It sort of reminds me of getting to 3rd job as a Bandit from a long time ago, working hard to get Assaulter. I'll say something about Sweeping Sword later.

Rai Sanrenzan, I like the extra number of attacks they added, it also feels a lot lighter for some reason, maybe some delay changes. The 3rd Hit looks really ugly. I don't know, it reminds me of that ugly Assassinate animation Shadower got in the RED update, the one that looks like triangular strikes or whatever. The color change? I don't mind it that much, it matches with most of the other attacking skill now.

Rai Blade Flash, yes Nexon made a typo, I don't think it ever did 5 number of hits. This attack is probably useful for bosses that has damage reflect. It has great attacking distance, it helps so that your Quick Draw stance isn't within range to reflect damage back to you.

Shinsoku, it's very fun now, being able to move with it, and I like how much faster it is. I should probably mention that I was worried that this skill would have a long delay after it stops attacking, like Jett's Backup Beatdown, but it's actually the same as most of the other rapid attacking skills like Hurricane and Mille Aiguilles.
I also noticed that once it stops attacking(after 12 seconds), it will reactivate itself if you don't move left or right or use a potion, that part is actually like Backup Beatdown.
Mashing either Falcon Dive or Sweeping Sword together with Shinsoku while in the basic stance cuts the delay off of those skills. You can spam Sweeping Sword sort of like Boomerang Step, or spam Falcon Kick like Captain Falcon(well, it's probably faster than him). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xxcYaIYZaGE People seem to really like it. For those who complain that Boomerang Step is too slow, well here you go, try a Hayato instead, spam-able Sweeping Sword.

Iron Skin got fixed. I guess it's fair since Hayato can boss a lot more better now. Maybe that's why it was stackable before the whole skill changes, it's like Nexon felt sorry for us or something. We can always wait for those new hyper stats in that Reboot update, 15% more status resistance. With that, I'll be at 98% status resistance anyways. *Small edit: Willpower just got to level 45, will be at 99% status resistance now.*

Eye for an Eye, previously named Counterattack. Finally, it's a toggle skill, finally we won't die from it activating and triggering something like damage reflect back at us.

Sudden Strike, the debuff from Falcon Dive was moved onto this skill and it's better since Sudden Strike deoesn't dive you forward into the boss like Falcon Dive does. It also helps to kill summons while also applying the debuff on the boss, you'll be in Quick Draw stance most of the time while bossing. Me being a noob at Chaos Zakum: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WFafEICobrU (Set the video speed at 2x)

Well, I think that's about it. Overall, I really like the skill changes. 97/100

Reply October 11, 2015 - edited
DemoDango

@sinknight: It is. I promise. It's actually 100%, by the way.

Reply October 8, 2015 - edited
Sinknight

Right now trying to hope any pray hitori strike -95% cooldown is still there...

Reply October 7, 2015 - edited
ChickenSoul

@nekiridaani: My bad, although it makes the case worse if we're considering the Reinforce on hyper skills to work like %TD. Whether the percent added is additive to the skill or multiplicative through the damage formula, it doesn't really detract from the point I was making, but thanks for informing me!

@demodango: More original hypers would be quite nice. Indeed, Falcon's Honor is similar to DA's hyper skill, and God of Blades is a carbon copy of Hero's Cry Valhalla.

Reply October 7, 2015 - edited
DemoDango

@deeemon: I should note that Hayato and Kanna were both broken (in the un-fun way) for more than a year before they started applying changes. JMS has always had trouble with balancing their content.
I do like the addition of Sudden Strike, and for the same reason. *brofist*
You can switch between stances without any delay, so you won't lose sword energy if you need FJ for anything. It's the same command, so you don't even have to fiddle with your key bindings.

EDIT: switching costs Sword Energy. My bad.

Reply October 7, 2015 - edited
billythakid1

@deeemon: Aw man I do love old Savage BIow but I'm still hype for hayato buffs. Hype hype hype

Reply October 7, 2015 - edited
DeeeMon

It's too early to judge, but I will miss the old Shinsoku, only because it reminded me of the really old original Savage Blow when it was a 1v1 skill, mainly seeing the damage numbers going up in a straight line. Rest in peace good ol memories.
I was also shocked to see Rai Blade Flash with 5 number of hits instead of 4, maybe it's just a typo? Rai Blade Flash looks like it might be strong as hell though. I think it's still a good 1v1 attack if a boss has damage reflect, you might kill yourself with Shinsoku if you don't stop fast enough. Shinsoku and Rai Blade Flash is useful in their own ways, it's good to have variety.
I think I will like Sudden Strike more than Falcon Dive, it was annoying to dive forward into bosses to apply that debuff. It's funny because that was the same reason why Assaulter was removed from Chief Bandit, dashing into bosses, yet Hayato still keeps Falcon Dive. I'm just glad Nexon of Japan knows how to make a class better and actually keep the fun.
I don't care much about flash jump(or Battoujutsu Leap), I will be staying in Quick Draw stance forever. Speaking of Quick Draw, there's a katana in Fire Emblem Fates called Quick-draw Katana. I don't know, I'm just thinking too much.
I'll probably post here again or in another thread after experiencing the whole skill changes in game.

Reply October 7, 2015 - edited
Srurtuphr

@demodango that's good to hear. It would be surprising to see 40% crit go away just like that, to be honest.
As for the hypers, sadly many classes suffer from not really useful hypers, especially the level 150 ones.
Hell, some hypers aren't as good as some other class's 3rd job skills, which is rather ridiculous.

Reply October 7, 2015 - edited
DemoDango

Indeed, you didn't read very carefully, @nekiridaani

1) The new Shinsoku deals more damage per second than Rai Blade Flash when you get the +1 hit hyper skill for it (available at lv 143)--at least, it does based on the damage/hit# values on the Japanese site I translated before. The Japanese site says 4 hits, not 5. Hmm. Whatever, we'll see after 1 PM PST. Also, Warrior's Heart lets you heal yourself much faster on Shinsoku.
2) Crit rate has been buffed, not nerfed. Battoujutsu Soul gave us 40% crit when active. The toggle-stance version now gives 50% at maximum Sword Energy (which doesn't take very long to build, it seems). With Hitokiri, that brings our crit chance to 95% (including the passive 5%) before adding the Phantom link skill or DSE.
3) It's worth noting that our passive dodge chance is now 85%. They forgot to mention Jinsoku's additional dodge chance going up to 50%, on top of Willow Dodge's elevated 35%.

@chickensoul I honestly rather like the animation change for Sanrenzan. *shrug*

EDIT: My only point of frustration is that they still haven't given much thought to the hyper skills. Hayato's 170 skill is the same as DAs or whichever class it was that I'm remembering (I've been away for a while). Kanna's 150 skill is a clone of F/Ps' 150. Hayato's 150 skill is not only not as useful as, say, Kaiser's, but it is actually OVERRIDDEN by the 4th job elemental/status resistance buff.

Reply October 7, 2015 - edited
billythakid1

To be honest, I like the way hayato's shinsoku is now (minus no chaining), but I have always been a fan of phantom's Mille Aiguilles. I'm just excited that I'll hopefully be doing as much deeps as my less funded, 13 level lower, little brother...on his aran.

Reply October 7, 2015 - edited
Srurtuphr

The nerf is because Battojutsu Soul was removed and I didn't see anything else to make up for it.
By the way just as a side note, that's not how the hypers work- the 20% reinforce acts as a %total dmg/ %boss, so it gets added along with the %boss and %total damage in the maximum damage calculation.
Haven't seen the new animation, will check it out now.

Reply October 7, 2015 - edited
ChickenSoul

I personally don't like the new Shinsoku being a hurricane, but it's not at all weaker than the one we had before. At 162% (182% if you bothered with the hyper buff), it was difficult even for heavily funded Hayatos to do decent damage on it, combined with the fact that it was incredibly slow if you didn't have dSI, AS +1, green MPE pot, etc. At 330%, it's basically converting your Falcon's Honor damage into your new Shinsoku damage, with a faster hit rate and (since patch notes didn't say anything, I'm hoping)the mastery increase giving you consistent damage. Personal preference aside, it's a nice boost. I'm 100% against the new Sanrenzan animation, though.

As for crit, I didn't notice any nerfs to it, but we'll see.

Reply October 7, 2015 - edited