General

Mille>RF by itself considering hypers and the -10% stolen skill dmg

so is FC + Mille > Rapid Fire now?

Good news, Max was wrong with his translation to Final Cut and he fixed it now.
The only change done to the skill is that you dont have to fully charge it now in order to gain full power. and also by the video
of some guy he activated it without hitting a monster, thats a nice improvement for phantoms.
I guess it time to get new inner - 50% Buff Duration!

I'm just really grateful for all the shorter buffcasting times in general.

[quote=WowChowMein]mind going more in depth with this? i never know about this multiple of 30 thing.[/quote]

Its not multiple of 30 per say. Its multiple of 3. It has been in MS for quite a awhile. I have no explantion for this except for the fact that it is just there. If you ask an extractor on Southeperry, they will tell you the same.

If you look at the [url=http://www.southperry.net/showthread.php?t=67622&title=[KMS][RED]%20Adventurer%20Bowman]Ultimate Skill Tables[/url] for Arrow Blaster in the Red Update, it had a 800ms fire rate or fired 12.5 hits per second. Yet, almost ANY well informed Bowmaster will tell you that Arrow Blaster never fired more than 11.111 hits per second which is a 900ms delay. 900 is divisible by 3 which is subsequently divisible by 30.

Mille is still a better option than RF or Hurricane assuming you hit more than 25m/line on Mille. With Mille alone and no platter, Phantom's total hits/s would be 7.69x3, 2 from Mille and 1 from Carte assuming you have 100% crit. That totals to about 23, vs. the total hits/s from hurricane or rf which would be 8.333x2, or 16.666. This means that with Mille phantoms have slightly more than 6 extra lines per second, so if despite the 130% damage you're still able to hit above a certain threshold Mille is still the better option, even with the Hurricane buff.

As for the Final Cut changes a good alternative buff to use is BM's 3rd job skill Reckless Hunt : Bow. While not as potent (only 40% TD) it's a fairly strong buff in its own right and you don't have to worry about Cooldowns or even rebuffing (it's a toggle skill). If you cap on Mille with just Cross Surge then you should likely still be using Arrow Platter, even despite it's nerf.

Um... isn't this update for the speed of Mille just the startup time? The KMST update before it states that the hits per second on Mille are higher now (higher meaning they hit more often in less time). If that's the case, does that not simply mean that it just takes a tenth of a second longer to start up the initial attack? If that's the case, it's not that big of a deal... and ultimately, that means Phantom is stronger overall for it.

>Be me
>See original post about Phantom changes
>Feel conflicted about sticking with NL now
>Debating whether or not to go back to Phantom (easily done since it still has cane/card/etc.)
>See Arrow blaster nerf with the cooldown
>Feel more conflicted and less likely to swap but in my mind I still know that now Milles is the same speed as Hurricane
>See FC change
>Know that it is no longer buff related and thus no more unlimited FC, unless you do the Sudden Raid thing. (Which I am still unsure about so if someone could/would quote me and explain that'd be grand)
>Feel more conflicted and try to possibly work around this feeling
>See that Milles is not 120ms anymore but some illogical 130ms
>Incentive to swap back to Phantom is gone
>RIP hopes of ever returning to Phantom

[quote=iEvanMaster]The reason that this buff was a big deal for phantoms was because instead of having to use RF for your 4th job skill, you could use Final Cut which would 1.6x your damage and make Mille deal more DPM than RF.
[b]However[/b], due to the recent change with Final Cut, this may not be all that viable, though the math does still say that there's a very slight increase in dps if you opt for Mille+FC.

Assuming 130ms, Mille hits 7.69 times per second.
(130*2)*7.69=2000*1.4=2800
(60% increase in damage, however if it is in fact true that final cut now applies a debuff instead of giving you a buff, this means that final cut can only have a 66.66% uptime for phantoms due to buff duration not affecting Final Cut any longer. But a video from KMST seems to contradict the above, so... for now, this is only an assumption based upon the translation provided by Orangemushroom.)
Rapid Fire:
330*8.33=2748.9 (2474% instead, if phantoms still have the 10% nerf for stolen skills.)[/quote]

The nerf is more like -30% from skills, my Rapid Fire does the same amount as my carte noir which is only 30% below it. Also Rapid fire % is 300 not 330, unless you're referring to Hurricane.

[quote=lnfinitiEagle]"Hurricane: damage has been increased from 300% to 330%"
Assuming the delay between attacks IS IN FACT 130ms then aren't we just replacing Rapid Fire with Hurricane regardless, now due to the change quoted above.
30% increase in dmg for Hurricane w/ 120ms delay is percent wise 10ms better and 330% > (130%x2) by a longshot [correct me if im wrong on any stats][/quote]

The reason that this buff was a big deal for phantoms was because instead of having to use RF for your 4th job skill, you could use Final Cut which would 1.6x your damage and make Mille deal more DPM than RF.
[b]However[/b], due to the recent change with Final Cut, this may not be all that viable, though the math does still say that there's a very slight increase in dps if you opt for Mille+FC.

Assuming 130ms, Mille hits 7.69 times per second.
(130*2)*7.69=2000*1.4=2800
(60% increase in damage, however if it is in fact true that final cut now applies a debuff instead of giving you a buff, this means that final cut can only have a 66.66% uptime for phantoms due to buff duration not affecting Final Cut any longer. But a video from KMST seems to contradict the above, so... for now, this is only an assumption based upon the translation provided by Orangemushroom.)
Rapid Fire:
330*8.33=2748.9 (2474% instead, if phantoms still have the 10% nerf for stolen skills.)

"Hurricane: damage has been increased from 300% to 330%"
Assuming the delay between attacks IS IN FACT 130ms then aren't we just replacing Rapid Fire with Hurricane regardless, now due to the change quoted above.
30% increase in dmg for Hurricane w/ 120ms delay is percent wise 10ms better and 330% > (130%x2) by a longshot [correct me if im wrong on any stats]

@WowChowMein @nitsua2789

Well, besides the obvious part of looking up skill delays in extractions, whenever you try and calculate attack speed delays for skills, you have to round up the final number to the nearest multiple of 30, if the number ends up even 1ms higher than a multiple of 30.

I'm as equally baffled by the 130ms delay to be honest; I don't get why Nexon would choose a number if it weren't possible--but I don't know, maybe they've changed it. Southperry extractions does list the number as 130, so we'll have to see if it'll actually apply as 130 or as 150.

[quote=iEvanMaster]From my understanding, it's not possible to have a skill's delay be a number that's not a multiple of 30, so I don't know why they changed Mille to 130ms... however, this should mean that the new delay is now 150ms, which means Mille's attack speed is nerfed by 20%.[/quote]

Got any particular basis for this logic? Because I'm not sure why they would change it to 130ms if it wasn't possible to have such a delay...

[quote=iEvanMaster]From my understanding, it's not possible to have a skill's delay be a number that's not a multiple of 30, so I don't know why they changed Mille to 130ms... however, this should mean that the new delay is now 150ms, which means Mille's attack speed is nerfed by 20%.[/quote]

mind going more in depth with this? i never know about this multiple of 30 thing.

Theres a video of new FC - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WY1BLdBSsJ8
Well it still give a buff even without hitting a monster, so max maybe was wrong with his translation.
That works now with Sudden Raid - using twice Sudden Raid will dercrease the CD to 57 Sec..
Someone in DB forum said its not working with buff duration IA anymore

[quote=Masterobert]@XxTRiiKzZ: It's a nice change that Mille will be our main bossing skill, and FC will still be useful in certain bosses still. For places like Dojo, if you don't hit cap, I would think Reckless Hunt: Bow will be best to use and for those who cap can use Arrow Blaster. I'm a little disappointed the attack speed was increased though.

What do you guys think our best Inner Ability is or would be? I currently have attack speed and other benefiting lines.[/quote]
I really love Mille, so I would love to keep it as our main skill, but as far as IA, I would aim for buff duration. Attack speed is nice, but it doesn't really benefit us sadly I can see it being nice with penombre, as in dodging out of the way faster, but other than that, not worth it imo. I currently have 35% buff duration IA and I have perm FC finally.

@XxTRiiKzZ: It's a nice change that Mille will be our main bossing skill, and FC will still be useful in certain bosses still. For places like Dojo, if you don't hit cap, I would think Reckless Hunt: Bow will be best to use and for those who cap can use Arrow Blaster. I'm a little disappointed the attack speed was increased though for Mille.
@AckarRed: Yes, I am well aware.

What do you guys think our best Inner Ability is or would be? I currently have attack speed and little benefiting lines.

[quote=okaythen]But I thought Mille is affect by attack speed?[/quote]
No, that only effects the start up, Mille is a fixed speed.

But I thought Mille is affect by attack speed?

[quote=Masterobert]What do you guys think on our bossing? Any other options?
Mille + Arrow (half as good, or extra summon/less duration stats)
Mille + Final Cut (?)
Mille + Reckless Hunt: Bow[/quote]
Well, I kinda liked the thought of Mille + FC lol I use it now too, unless I'm doing dojo, but I see arrow platter got somewhat nerfed and buffed? it's 140% when planted, but only lasts 15 seconds now. Not sure if its good or bad lol, but if FC is only going to effect the mobs you hit, I guess that's out of the question. What are your thoughts? :o I watch your videos and I see you use RF a lot.

[quote=Masterobert]What do you guys think on our bossing? Any other options?
Mille + Arrow (half as good, or extra summon/less duration stats)
Mille + Final Cut (?)
Mille + Reckless Hunt: Bow[/quote]

Just so you know, Arrow Blaster has a cooldown now

What do you guys think on our bossing? Any other options?
Mille + Arrow (half as good, or extra summon/less duration stats)
Mille + Final Cut (?)
Mille + Reckless Hunt: Bow

[quote=XxTRiiKzZ]Yeah, this is why I'm kinda sad lol I hope it goes back to 120ms.
@antimorox123 ik that much lol I meant in terms of dps.[/quote]

From my understanding, it's not possible to have a skill's delay be a number that's not a multiple of 30, so I don't know why they changed Mille to 130ms... however, this should mean that the new delay is now 150ms, which means Mille's attack speed is nerfed by 20%.

[quote=xBustyAngelz]Well now its slower than hurricane.[/quote]
Yeah, this is why I'm kinda sad lol I hope it goes back to 120ms.
@antimorox123 ik that much lol I meant in terms of dps.

10ms(miliseconds)

Well now its slower than hurricane.