General

Evan

Discuss Evan's Fifth Job Skill, Elemental Blast

I'll start:
Apart from having a breathtaking animation, the stats:

Evan's Elemental Blast: A timeline through the ages:
KMST 1.2.035 5th job & Road to Vanishing FIRST DRAFT Level 50: Consumes 1000 MP. Use 4 consecutive magic spells that deal 600% damage 6 times on up to 15 enemies. Cooldown: 150 seconds
KMST 1.2.036 5th job and road to vanishing SECOND DRAFT: Level 50: Consumes 1000 MP. Use 4 consecutive magic spells that deal 1500% damage 6 times on up to 15 enemies with an additional 100% critical rate. Cooldown: 60 seconds
KMS 1.2.259 Road to Vanshing FINAL: Level 20: Consumes 1000 MP. Use 4 consecutive magic spells that deal 900% damage 6 times on up to 15 enemies with an additional 100% critical rate. Cooldown:60 seconds.
KMS 1.2.261 Server issues: Level 20: Consumes 1000 MP. Use 4 consecutive magic spells that deal 1350% damage 6 times on up to 15 enemies with an additional 100% critical rate. Cooldown: 60 seconds.
KMST 1.2.038 City of Dreams FIRST DRAFT: Level 25: Consumes 1000 MP. Use 4 consecutive magic spells that deal 1500% damage 6 times on up to 15 enemies with an additional 100% critical rate. After attacking, your final damage is increased by 5% per different elemental spell hit. Cooldown: 60 seconds.
If you'll notice, it was the strongest it ever was in the second test server RIGHT before it went live.
4 consecutive spells that each do a whopping 1500% damage, six times, on 15 enemies with a cooldown of only a minute, right before it was cruelly nerfed to 900%
... That is, until now.
a mere 2 patches later, after being nerfed hard in the live server, the nerfs have been fully reverted.
With a couple improvements thrown in:
It takes less Core Fusion to max it out, and has an additional 5% final damage per spell hit.

If they don't revert it in the live update for the Arcane River: City of Dreams update hits that is.

August 16, 2016

35 Comments • Newest first

nitsua2789

@juarmo: The original intent of the scenario was that you were driving along an empty highway, whether you think that was or wasn't the case. Also it does require conscious thought to drive along an empty highway, otherwise you'd probably end up killing yourself. That's why it's illegal to drive while drunk. Because you NEED to pay attention.

It doesn't introduce a single new mechanic, you yourself listed out at least 5 other skills that do the same exact thing. Having elemental attributes isn't inherently interesting, only if it's pulled off in a cool synergistic way (like NW's 5th job skill and Dark omen benefiting from other Dark Element attacks) is it interesting. I listed off plenty of examples of what I consider to be interesting 5th job skills, and Elemental Blast pales in comparison to all of them.

I'm not commenting on your ideal of a 5th job skill because it isn't really relevant to the conversation. I don't particularly care what they implement as a 5th job skill so long as it is interesting and or good (which, as I've stated numerous times, Elemental Blast is not). Whether it's something to do with Dragon Master or not makes no difference to me.

Again, you're being incredibly (and needlessly) pedantic. Harping on what the definition of what "interest" is or trying to find (non-existent) logical fallacies is defeating the point. You yourself even said it's a boring skill as far as 5th job skills go, so I'm not sure why you're continuing to argue the point. Here's a nice article explaining the difference between grabbing someones attention and keeping their interest: http://marketingland.com/grabbing-attention-vs-getting-people-to-care-70510

Elemental Blast is uninteresting, weak, and overall underwhelming as Evan's only 5th job skill. It's a disappointment, and no amount of soap-boxing will change that fact.

Reply August 29, 2016
juarmo

one last time for clarity:
This was stated 2 pages ago, yet keeps getting ignored.
**But, yeah, it is among the more boring 5th job skills.
A lot of the 5th job concepts HAVEN'T been done before, i'd like a more unique skill!**
Here's to hoping we get something more gimmicky!
[i]Personally, I'm hoping the next 5th job skill is a passive buff to the Dragon Master Hyper Skill (increasing it's hitbox considerably, removing/considerably reducing its cooldown and/or increasing its duration considerably and maybe a SLIGHT final damage boost to everything), that would passively change Mir's appearance, and change all "Mir" animations to reflect a larger Mir, and automatically upgrade the mount skill too.

(I really want Mir to grow biggar... its the main thing i'm disappointed about in 5th job. He didn't get redesigned at all in REBORN, unlike Wild Hunter's Jag and Mech's Mech... Still looks like Lo-Res SD trash, especially noticable because of the mark on his head is barely recognizable , if he grows again, he gets redesigned, so... ) [/i]
I feel like my suggestion fits your tastes to a T.

I feel my wishes go hand-in-hand with yours because it changes the way Evan bosses by changing existing skills, (meaning Dragon Master becomes a great deal more integral to bossing) and makes his dragon grow, replacing a great deal of skill animations.
The only interest I have in elemental blast is the fact that it's Evan's first, and currently only 5th job skill.
It's the most interesting skill to me because it's mine.
It is because it's the only 5th job skill that's of concern to us is what makes it so disappointing.

Also, no, I did not changing the highway scenario. That was all you.
The initial scenario YOU PRESENTED was "A billboard in an empty highway" WORD FOR WORD.
In fact, you mentioned NOTHING of driving, which could mean the person was walking alongside the highway.
It was, in fact, YOU who changed the scenario to your own advantage (unsuccessfully, I might add, because it was as easy to dismantle as pointing out that driving on an EMPTY highway doesn't take conscious thought) by saying that "one could argue that it takes your attention away from driving"
But no one said the person was DRIVING on the highway. That was, in fact, the first time cars were brought up at all.
The highway's empty except for you and the billboard. Who's to say you're even IN a car yourself?
I don't think its interesting because of that, nitsua's the one who said "introducing new mechanics would make it interesting."
The point was, it introduces new mechanics, but those mechanics don't fundamentally affect gameplay.
Mechanics don't necessarily make something interesting, because certain mechanics are just for polish's sake.

But what REALLY makes it interesting is the fact that it's a lighting spell, a fire/earth spell, an ice spell, and a holy/dark/physical spell all at once.
It really fits, not only thematically, but is mechanically interesting because it has multiple elemental properties, and hopefully, arcane river mobs have elemental attributes for the first time since Twilight Perion (though I believe World Tree's mobs are weak to holy magic).
I actually wanted something like this as a HYPER skill

Reply August 29, 2016
Gurenn

@nitsua2789: i know, but still would be better than elemental blast

Reply August 29, 2016
nitsua2789

@gurenn: All classes get a bind skill in 5th job, as well as the rope jump thing.

Reply August 29, 2016
Gurenn

I honestly was specting a bind skill, since freud has designed some magical seals according to the ms story(not sure about this fact,could be wrong) and it seemed thematically fit for evans a.k.a. Freud's heir to have a seal. I was specting one for hyper skill when revamped got teased and then i got my hopes up for 5th job but no luck.

@juarmo: also you call the skill interesting because it's four animations together but in my opinion, honestly, if we look at the animations they are not really cool in my opinion

Reply August 29, 2016
nitsua2789

@juarmo: You're changing the highway scenario to fit your argument. Things can also be annoying and eye-catching, changing the word doesn't make any difference.

Blade Storm has two distinct parts, an initial attack and then the follow up continuous attack.

I wasn't talking about BPM I was talking about the hyper skill, which has two distinct phases, the build up of debris on the map and then a final explosion.

But if we want to look at mana burst it's not much different than an endlessly repeated animation. Each use results in 2 streams which look identical but have different % damage values.

The fact of the matter is that Elemental Blast is among the least interesting/strong 5th job skills (if not the least in both regards). Altering the definition of interesting to suit your own opinion of what is or isnt interesting is being pedantic and defeating the point of the conversation.

I think the majority opinion here is that the skill is very underwhelming and definitely not what anyone wanted for Evans 5th job.

Reply August 29, 2016
juarmo

That was my second time writing that post, and I got an error message the first time
I rewrote it a few days later from memory.
I meant to say "annoyance" not "distraction"
Like a white spec on black paper, it stands out because compared to everything else, it is, in fact, interesting.
It gets your interest because there's nothing else nearby to capture it.
You said "empty highway", you could be walking alongside said highway, and considering its empty, as in devoid of ANYTHING, you need not focus on driving. It's a moment's reprieve from sheer boredom.
If it wasn't even the slightest bit interesting, it wouldn't even catch your eye. It doesn't reflect sun in your eye, it doesn't make any annoying sounds. At best, its bright colors draw your attention. Bright colors are associated with fun and a good time
Billboards are meant to advertise crap, if they didn't stand out in your mind, they'd fail to do so effectively. In other words, they are put in empty highways because that's where they stand out. That's where you'll notice them, and that's how your subconscious will dwell on their message long after it's been pushed out of conscious thought.

Ultimate B.P.M.? Blade Storm? You and me are thinking two different things.
Ultimate B.P.M., Blade Storm, and Asura's Anger (and Shade's Spirit Transformation) are just repeating the same skill animation until it ends, they might as well be keydowns...
What makes this skill interesting is that it's multiple DIFFERENT skills strung together.
As in, multiple skills treated as one by making sure one goes into the next one without any way of canceling between them.
That's mechanically interesting.
Shadow Rain has two distinct sets of animations, hitboxes, and hitcounts
Battle King Bar is/was originally the same way (wind-up, then slam!)
Mana Burst IV is also the same way (projectile magic, then explodes into pentagrams!)
Elemental blast is FOUR distinct animations strung together.

You really think those standards of interest are below average?
When Michael Bay movies sell millions?
You know, the guy who can't tell his plot development from his explosions?
OF COURSE Evan's 5th job is interesting by normal standards.
The only reason I care about Elemental Blast is this:
https://youtu.be/gMIACYUESWI?t=633
Replace "Setsuna" with Juarmo and "Exia" with Evan

But I'll quote myself again:
**But, yeah, it is among the more boring 5th job skills.
A lot of the 5th job concepts HAVEN'T been done before, i'd like a more unique skill!**
Here's to hoping we get something more gimmicky!
[i]Personally, I'm hoping the next 5th job skill is a passive buff to the Dragon Master Hyper Skill (increasing it's hitbox considerably, removing/considerably reducing its cooldown and/or increasing its duration considerably and maybe a SLIGHT final damage boost to everything), that would passively change Mir's appearance, and change all "Mir" animations to reflect a larger Mir, and automatically upgrade the mount skill too.

(I really want Mir to grow biggar... its the main thing i'm disappointed about in 5th job. He didn't get redesigned at all in REBORN, unlike Wild Hunter's Jag and Mech's Mech... Still looks like Lo-Res SD trash, especially noticable because of the mark on his head is barely recognizable , if he grows again, he gets redesigned, so... ) [/i]
I feel like my suggestion fits your tastes to a T.

I feel my wishes go hand-in-hand with yours because it changes the way Evan bosses by changing existing skills, (meaning Dragon Master becomes a great deal more integral to bossing) and makes his dragon grow, replacing a great deal of skill animations.

Reply August 29, 2016 - edited
nitsua2789

@juarmo: Things can be distracting and eye-catching, the two aren't mutually exclusive. The billboard is arguably distracting you from the road, it's purely an issue of semantics.

There's a lot of skills that exist as multiple attacks, besides the ones you listed there's also the Kinesis ultimate, the DB 5th job skill, and probably many more than I'm not familiar with. On top of not being a new concept it's not in the least bit interesting.

You obviously have a much lower standard for interest than I (or average people, for that matter) do. Just because the empty highway is equally boring doesn't mean a touch of difference becomes exciting or interesting. A billboard is hardly anything compared to entering a city or an urban area, which is what I would consider to be the analog to your example of "sporadic enjoyment."

Reply August 29, 2016 - edited
juarmo

@nitsua2789 That is flawed logic right there.
Neurological studies have shown evidence that the brain perceives things emotionally in contrast.
That billboard example comes to mind.
Have fun all the time, and fun starts to get bland. Get bored every now and then, the fun stands out more.
Boredom 24/7 and it begins to be unbearable, but when you finally have start to have fun, it's a total blast.
Happiness starts to lose meaning when its eternal, its only when you take the bad with the good that your happiness has any weight.
Same with sadness, when you're sad all the time, it's more of a dull ache than anything.
You need to experience happiness to know sadness, you need to experience boredom to know fun, and the billboard stands out in an empty highway, because it IS interesting when all else is a wasteland.

Also, look who doesn't understand the difference between distracting and eye-catching.
Someone screaming on the subway is distracting
A shiny new pair of sneakers is eye-catching
Sunlight reflecting off of a phone is distracting
A powerful sourcerer casting consecutive elemental spells of Earth, Wind, and Fire (and Water, people seem to always forget water when listing elements ) with breath-taking power is eye-catching.
nitsua 2789 is distracting
my good looks are eye-catching (so I'm told, I have self-esteem issues)
There's a difference between getting someone's attention and taking it away from something else.
A distraction is little more than an annoyance. Something eye-catching is ACTUALLY interesting (or relatively so.)

I'd like to repeat this:
New mechanics?
It's one of the few skills that is actually multiple skills strung together forcibly (Mana Burst IV and Sweeping Staff also come to mind, as well as Bunker Buster and Shadow Rain [actually, shadow rain might just be one], that makes it more than a simple Blast, its 4 different blasts, which means that, like Mana burst, if it kills the first wave of mobs and more spawn bfore it ends, it will hit those too)
[b]But, yeah, it is among the more boring 5th job skills.
A lot of the 5th job concepts HAVENT been done before, i'd like a more unique skill![/b]
Here's to hoping we get something more gimmicky!
[i]Personally, I'm hoping the next 5th job skill is a passive buff to the Dragon Master Hyper Skill (increasing it's hitbox considerably, and maybe a SLIGHT final damage boost to everything), that would passively change Mir's appearance, and change all "Mir" animations to reflect a larger Mir, and automatically upgrade the mount skill too.

(I really want Mir to grow biggar... its the main thing i'm disappointed about in 5th job. He didn't get redesigned at all in REBORN, unlike Wild Hunter's Jag and Mech's Mech... Still looks like Lo-Res SD trash, especially noticable because of the mark on his head is barely recognizable , if he grows again, he gets redesigned, so... ) [/i]
I feel like my suggestion fits your tastes to a T.

Reply August 28, 2016 - edited
nitsua2789

@juarmo: The only one with flawed logic is yourself, lmao. Just because something is "less interesting" doesn't make the other thing automatically interesting. There's a threshold for genuine interest and a billboard definitely does not meet that threshold.

If I went to a restaurant and everything tasted like crap, but one dish tasted slightly better than the rest, that doesn't mean it tastes good, it just tastes less bad. The same applies to the billboard.

Ultimates =/= Burst Damage. Nobody used Blizzard, Meteor Shower, or Genesis to take out bosses, they used them to train. Their damage vs. a single target wasn't anywhere near as good as just using your main 1v1 attack.

A person screaming on subway is attention grabbing but they aren't interesting, they're annoying and or grating. Sunlight reflecting off of someones phone or watch is eye-catching, but it's not something you stop and admire. Getting someones attention can be done in a number of ways, holding their interest is an entirely different matter.

Reply August 24, 2016 - edited
juarmo

@nitsua2789: That is not true.
An empty highway is bland scenery. Billboards are eye catching on an empty highway because, while not particularly interesting in and of themselves, they are eye-catching because they're the [i]most[/I] interesting thing in sight when you're in an empty highway. They stand out because everything else is [b]significantly[/b] less interesting.

Ergo, your logic is flawed. There's a reason why the words "interest" and "attention" are synonymous.
"Can you capture their interest long enough to convince them to stop fighting and work together?" "OK, you have their attention, now rally them under a common goal"

PS: You all should be ashamed to call yourselves mages, we STARTED the whole massive burst attack thing when FOURTH job was introduced. Genesis, Blizzard, Meteor Shower, and Dark Fog were the OG FMAs, they existed LONG before the rest (excluding Heaven's Hammer and Combo Tempest [RIP I guess?]) To say you were never a fan of them is like saying you were never a fan of teleport and/or telecasting, or elemental damage, or wands/staves.

Reply August 24, 2016 - edited
SorLilly

I have watched a few classes' 5th job skills including NL, xenon, hero, and a few others. They all have really nice skills. Those skills either have good amount of duration or perm idk. I'm not sure if it's because we are stronger than those from 1st to 4th skills, that's why we don't receive a really strong one ? I haven't seen the rest but so far NL, demon slayer, and hero have really nice ones. But ours is kinda lame idk.

Reply August 23, 2016 - edited
nitsua2789

@juarmo: Install Maha is basically just an attack buff with a Final Attack.

Interesting 5th job skills:
-Paladin - cool synergy effect w/ party members using your own attacks and recieving your invincibility.
-Mihile - can be tailored to either benefit the party or benefit you solo, trading off benefits depending on the situation
-Demon Slayer - drastically improves the base attack skill of DS to be better than Demon Impact, changing how you fight bosses.
-Marksman - the closest thing to being an actual sniper you will ever get in maplestory
-Shadower - finally bringing back assaulter and allowing for really cool combo possibilities
-Night Walker - synergy with Dark Element attacks and changes effectiveness depending on how many targets you're fighting

Being eye-catching doesn't make something interesting. Billboards on an empty highway are eye-catching but they definitely are not interesting.

Reply August 22, 2016 - edited
juarmo

@nitsua2789: So, is your favorite Fifth Job skill Install Maha?
That fits your description

You obviously are supposed to include Swift Return, because if the thing you Elemental Blast on is a boss, you're supposed to have Swift Return on at all times, and if they AREN'T a boss, then they're just gonna die anyway, so there's no point in using it at all.

Flashy = Eye-Catching
Eye-Catching = Intetresting.
Therefore, in accordance with transitive relation, Flashy = Interesting.
God I love math.

Reply August 22, 2016 - edited
nitsua2789

@juarmo: Nobody every said Swift Return wasn't final damage, I even included it parenthesis in my comment. Partners however is %dmg, and Dragon Fury is %atk, those are the two that should not have been included. I don't include Swift Return in the base multiplier because it's a debuff that you have to apply and wont always be on everything you attack, whereas Elemental Decrease and Magic Amplification are both passives that are always active.

Flashy =/= interesting. I define interesting as something that actually changes the function of skills or adds a new layer of mechanics over what already exists, which admittedly not many 5th job skills do. However even the ones that aren't necessarily interesting are more effective / beneficial than Blast, and the fact that Blast is neither strong nor interesting only hurts it in my opinion.

Reply August 21, 2016 - edited
juarmo

@nitsua2789: First off, Swift Return IS final damage iirc, just maybe mislabeled.
At least, it doesn't appear get diluted regardless of my %Boss [set bonuses, faf wand], %total damage [old emblem], or %magic attack (secondary)
And based on the amount it boosts my dmg by, the same is true of Partners.
In fact, of the ones I listed, I think the only thing that stacks additively, is Dragon Fury, but I could be wrong about Amplification. I know I'm not wrong about Elemental Decrease as it outright SAYS final damage.
But Swift Return and Partners only say damage, not Total Damage, not Boss Damage, not Final Damage, just "Damage". They could easily be Final Damage Boosts, as I theorize.

It isn't that bad, after all, the guy used BOTH Dragon Dive AND Earth Circle AFTER the animation started, (Dragon dive wasn't set up before he cast it, and Earth Circle would only trigger Earth Dive if it was casted during or after setting up Dragon Dive) meaning you're essentially free to spam Mana Burst after setting up Wind Breath by dual casting Wind Circle and Dragon Breath during the animation...
In other words, it just adds to your DPS, without taking anything away from it... (Although, its possible that he triggered it between Blasts, cause it seems there was a gap between two blasts when he used Dive of Earth)

Interesting?
Define interesting?
This is one of the flashiest skills I've ever seen really.
Plus, I love the series of consecutive powerful spells of Earth, Wind, and Fire (and Water/Ice ), it's really cool imo.
Only natural for an elementalist to do something like that

It's one of the few skills that is actually multiple skills strung together forcibly (Mana Burst IV and Sweeping Staff also come to mind, as well as Bunker Buster and Shadow Rain [actually, shadow rain might just be one], that makes it more than a simple Blast, its 4 different blasts, which means that, like Mana burst, if it kills the first wave of mobs and more spawn bfore it ends, it will hit those too)
But, yeah, it is among the more boring skills.
A lot of the 5th job concepts HAVENT been done before, i'd like a more unique skill!
Here's to hoping we get something more gimmicky!
Personally, I'm hoping the next 5th job skill is a passive buff to the Dragon Master Hyper Skill (increasing it's hitbox considerably, and maybe a SLIGHT final damage boost to everything), that would passively change Mir's appearance, and change all "Mir" animations to reflect a larger Mir, and automatically upgrade the mount skill too.

(I really want Mir to grow biggar... its the main thing i'm disappointed about in 5th job. He didn't get redesigned at all in REBORN, unlike Wild Hunter's Jag and Mech's Mech... Still looks like Lo-Res SD trash, especially noticable because of the mark on his head is barely recognizable , if he grows again, he gets redesigned, so... )

Reply August 21, 2016 - edited
nitsua2789

@juarmo: I only factored in final damage and weapon multipliers, not %atk or %dmg, as they are stats that you can gain through potentials and they work slightly differently than final damage and wep multipliers (less value the more you have). It's misleading to use them in calculations like this because they vary by class and individual whereas final damage and wep multipliers remain constant.

If you factor in final dmg on elemental blast its 36,000 x 1.3 (1.4 if you return swift). That puts it at 46,800 (50,400). The skill itself takes about 2.5s to cast all 4 spells, meaning it's averaging 18,720% dmg/s (20,160% w/ return). The %dmg/s of Evan's after the nerfs using Wind Flash and Thunder Dive (which would no longer be ideal post nerf but ill just use the numbers anyways) is 9,703%/s, 10,450%/s with return swift. That means it would take approximately 5 seconds of attacking to do more damage than Elemental Blast. Other classes (like the aforementioned NW) deal 16,780%/s without any 5th job skills, and that gets increased by a ridiculous amount when you factor in their 5th job skill.

I'm not saying that Elemental Blast isn't worth using, obviously you should cast it whenever you are able, but it pales in comparison to the majority of 5th job skills in terms of value and Evan is already in the middle of the pack as far as damage output goes. Therefore my opinion stands, it's a bad skill.

If you compare it to only other "burst" 5th job skills, it becomes especially obvious how bad it actually is.

The following uses no multipliers whatsoever, just the skills.
Elemental Blast: 36,000% dmg
Marksman: 6 arrows dealing 2160% 7 times on 12 enemies, 100% final dmg bonus based on distance (built into the skill) 181,400% dmg possible
Dual Blade: 900% x 8 initial damage, then 550% x 5 every 0.3s for 10s, 7,200 + 82,500 = 89,700%
Xenon: 500% dmg 6 times every 0.3s for 7s, 63,000%
Cannoneer: up to 3 bullets at once, each dealing 750% 4 times every 0.5s as it hits an enemy, not sure on duration but if using a time frame of 5s that's 30,000 per bullet, 90,000 possible.
Bowmaster: 50% of the time arrows rain from the sky dealing 450% x 5 every 0.12s, over a period of 5s that's about 46,875%
Phantom: 420% per card, 15 cards/s, 6s duration, 37,800% (comes with buffs much better than the final dmg buff after elemental blast)

You could argue that NL and NW also have "burst" style skills based on their functionality but I'll exclude them because it's a little more difficult to calculate their dmg value, and I think the points been made.

I stand corrected about the skill usage during Blast, in all the videos I've seen nobody has used any other attacks during it, however that doesn't change my mind, I still would've liked to see a much better (if not at least interesting) 5th job skill.

Reply August 21, 2016 - edited
juarmo

@nitsua2789: Final Damage? Weapon Multipliers?
There's your issue: you're factoring in things I didn't
When I said 36,000% without factoring in anything, I meant ANYTHING:
Nothing was factored in, not Magic Amplification, Not Dragon Fury, not Partners, not Swift Return, not Elemental Decrease's passive effect, and not any Passive Skills, nothing.
It'd be much higher than 36,000% total when you factor in the multiplier!
@Keyan22 LOL XD
EDIT: I crunched the numbers, and factoring in nerfed Decrease (15%), nerfed amplification (15%), nerfed swift return (10%), Dragon Fury (35%), and Partners (20%), it's at an insane 84,841% damage when you factor in everything.
IT'S OVER 80 THOUSAND!
Edit2: and I found this vid of an Evan casting Dive of Earth while in the middle of Elemental Blast:
https://youtu.be/ytFL1gk6czE?t=1636
So you're wrong about not being able to multicast lol
And if you'll notice, neither Dragon Dive nor Circle of Earth was active BEFORE casting Elemental Blast, meaning BOTH of them are free to attack during Elemental Blast

Reply August 21, 2016 - edited
XVi3tX

Max said the final damage buff only lasts 10 seconds ;_;

Reply August 19, 2016 - edited
Sammi

Honestly, I'm not a fan of burst skills/ultimates. Would've been neater if we got something like summon ancient dragons to swarm the map or something idk.

Reply August 18, 2016 - edited
nitsua2789

@risingrain: I'd be willing to bet at least 15 classes can output the same level of damage %/s. And I never said anything about changing classes so thanks for the snide remark.

Jump attacking is effectively twice the hits/s of regular attacking and if you set it up properly then initiating it isn't a big deal, you simply have to get good at pressing both keys at the same time (or use sticky keys and sacrifice some responsiveness). Even using it for short periods of time is worth it unless you're really bad at the timing.

Classes I think are likely to match that damage %/s(but I'm too lazy to do the math for): Aran (safe bet), Dawn Warrior, Demon Slayer, Blaster (safest bet), Kaiser, Wild Hunter, Shadower (safe bet), Shade, Mechanic, Thunder Breaker

It's also likely most mages could as well, especially explorer mages, because we all have a decent amount of final damage (and explorer mages actually have a weapon multiplier, whereas no other staff/wand mages do). The exceptions to this are probably Luminous and Kanna, maybe Battle Mage.

Reply August 17, 2016 - edited
RisingRain

@nitsua2789: There are over 40 classes. Being in the top 15% is perfectly fine. Now, if you really want to refund a new main to 30-40k stat every time a new update rolls around because your class isn't going to be the cream of the crop anymore, be my guest. You seem to be rich enough to do so anyway.

And what I meant about jump attacking isn't that you can't do it. It's not very efficient when you maybe get 1 or 2 jump casts in before you have to stop jump attacking, move around, and then get back into jump attacking again.

Phase 1 Lucid is definitely more annoying than Damien. If your party doesn't have enough DPS (enough DPS meaning your party can down 1.45T HP in about 20-30s) she will summon plenty of those golems right around your party to do 80% HP damage on touch, so you'll have to reposition yourself. Someone has to go over to the fairy trumpet statues once in a while to clear the butterflies in the background or else once there's enough they will swarm and 1HKO everyone in the party.

Reply August 17, 2016 - edited
keyan22

I thought I made this thread at first, lol.

Reply August 17, 2016 - edited
nitsua2789

@risingrain: I'd say going from "no other class can even do close to it" to having a list of 6 other classes that can do it is enough proof to justify my complaints about the bad 5th job skill. Not gonna sit here and do math on every single class to see whether or not they can.

Also jump attacking is practical in the new bosses unless you're specifically referring to Lucid, I side main my NW and had no issue jump attacking in Lotus and Damien. Obviously I haven't tried Lucid but Phase 1 Lucid doesn't look any worse than Damien.

Reply August 17, 2016 - edited
RisingRain

@nitsua2789: Need some proof on a "good amount" of classes can output it.
Heroes can, Xenons can, NW can with jump attacking (which isn't practical on the new bosses), DrK's can, Phantoms can (because they can steal Cross Surge + Final Cut), and maybe DBs can.

Reply August 17, 2016 - edited
nitsua2789

@xvi3tx: Hopefully we get more details when it hits the normal servers, but the Cd on the ultimate is only 60s so even if its just 10-20s of the buff we could still get decent use out of it.

Reply August 17, 2016 - edited
XVi3tX

Does anyone know how long the final damage buff lasts? o: So glad we gain back 20% final damage~

Reply August 17, 2016 - edited
nitsua2789

@risingrain: That's not true, offhand I know Nw is capable of that output and their 5th job skill is actually one of the strongest. Hero's are also able to as a result of their massive final dmg (for clarification I used Evans final damage values in that earlier statement). Xenon can output at a very high level as well and their 5th job skill is probably the strongest burst skill in the game.

36,000% in 4s means you're doing 9,000%/s, which isn't actually very high. DrK's are capable of it, Phantom's are capable of it, a good deal of classes are able to put out 9000%/s.

Reply August 17, 2016 - edited
RisingRain

@nitsua2789: Really not sure why you're complaining when no other class can do even close to 36,000% damage in 4s consistently. It's pretty fair that Evans get handed a fairly useless 5th job skill for balance.

Reply August 17, 2016 - edited
nitsua2789

@juarmo: I'm assuming you haven't seen anyone actually use the skill. You can't use anything except maybe magic debris during the attack, it's both an Evan and Mir skill. The skill itself lasts about 2-3s because the animation is so large.

It's bad. The only redeeming quality is the final dmg buff. You can easily output 36,000% damage in a matter of 4s with thunder dive and wind flash.

Reply August 17, 2016 - edited
juarmo

It's bad?
It's 4 spells that each do 1500% damage 6 times.
That's 24 x 1500%
Even without taking into account damage multipliers, that's 30,000% damage.
Not to mention, it's either an Evan skill or a Mir Skill. (not sure which)

Meaning that "attacking normally" doesn't Mir-ly have to beat Elemental Blast's DPS, it has to beat elemental Blast's DPS PLUS either Mir's Skills or Evan's skills, depending on which one ISN'T framelocked, assuming either of them are locked into the casting delay of the skill.
Considering I believe you can cast Dragon Breath, Circle of Wind, Dark Fog, AND detonate Magic Debris (Magic debris has zero casting delay, and can be used while Evan, Mir, or the both of them are locked in to the frames of other skills. I forget dark fog is there, but I don't believe it gets in the way of casting other things at all, either.) all at once, this shouldn't be a huge issue.
Even if it frame locks ONE of them, you can still cast Elemental Blast alongside Circle of Mana OR Mir's Breath. (if it's a "Mir skill", it might even be possible to set up mir's breath beforehand, then cast Elemental Blast and spam circle of Mana.)

TLDR: you're miscalculating. Elemental blast will almost certainly be capable of being used concurrently with EITHER Circle of Mana or Breath of Wind, depending on which one of them isn't busy casting Elemental blast, if not BOTH, if it turns out neither of them get locked into it.

Reply August 16, 2016 - edited
Gurenn

Also that ^

Reply August 16, 2016 - edited
nitsua2789

Overall it's pretty bad, before the final dmg buff got added it was basically worthless. In terms of burst damage it would only take about 3-4 seconds of normally attacking to deal more damage that the entire ultimate.

Reply August 16, 2016 - edited
Gurenn

Well, personally, i don't really like big AoE skills so i was not thrilled for this skill anyway and it didn't help that the secondary effect of the skill was 100% crit (which i already have anyways), but i must say this extra final damage does look appealing

Reply August 16, 2016 - edited