General

Am I the only one who'd love to see the enraged version of blow as out main mobbing skill? the concept of the other mobbing attacks brandish and IS are slashing up and down, while blow lacks in this function that makes a hero feel like a hero. if they made the enraged version our main mobbing skill, then they could make enrage itself into its own bossing skill separate of blow. I feel like this would help in regaining the feeling of hero, which is meant to feel like strong blows, not the "fairy duster" as I read blow looks like now. I also do agree with adding another form of combo, which in 3rd job can be the red/pink we have for fourth, and change the fourth to a new color, to bring us to the damage we need. I also think something needs to be done with our damage. Hero's concept, which nexon said they want to "keep," is strong attacks in sacrifice of defense. so an increase in the damage hero can do, or increase of lines might help. Besides this, they might as well just revamp the whole class, because they really left this class lacking like they did with bucc. it wasn't the best they could do.

Tbh, I do think heroes need a small boost in mobbing ability. It's painful to do train or do kritias quests even when you 1 hit the mobs.

^Nice dress

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Idunno, I wouldn't mind if ACA gave 1% or 2% damage reduction per orb (Then once enraged we'd lose the buff 'cause rage mode = more damage, less defense)

Heroes don't need anything, as a hero i feel cool,unique,badass even with low damage.
And i don't need to compete myself on other class .

[quote=eolay]I want to pitch in my opinion. It's based mostly on what fighters and crusaders used to be before fourth job even came out and I feel it should follow that.
Crusaders used to have the most stable damage of all the three branches, along with the ability to hit the highest number on one line(with panic). Dragon Knights used to have the biggest range, and Paladins had elements which unfortunately are less useful now.

1. 20 orbs seems fair enough seeing that we can charge 2 orbs in one attack, if we increase the 30% chance to charge an orb after getting hit to 100%. The colour scheme would be something like Blue -> Red -> Yellow -> Green (I don't know, I'm not a designer).

2. 150% damage is totally reasonable, but I disagree with the stacks of attack speed. This would make heroes way too strong so you only give one or the other. To follow the original fighter theme of slow but hard hitting I'd choose damage over speed for Heroes.

3. I feel that Raging Blow should be the same damage every time. In fact Raging Blow should have the animation changed because right now it looks pretty disgusting on both axes and swords. I also feel it should only do 2 or 3 hits maximum but having a way higher damage cap. [quote=darkspawn980 ... to be honest i don't get why a spear i throw randomly pops 8 lines of damage. I 100% agree with darkspawn980.

4. I'm not too fussed about recovery as a class being one of the strongest shouldn't also have high vitality (even though they did have the highest and lowest base hp and mp respectively). Instead of implementing recovery skills, a slight hp buff would be better suited.

Another move that would affect everyone would be to allow the use of potions while attacking.[/quote]

If we do get 20 orbs, I just want the ability to change the color of my orbs, just like Kaisers can change the color of their skins.

[quote=eolay]http://orangemushroom.net/2014/07/16/kmst-ver-1-2-509-more-skill-changes/

"In the last patch, we tried to raise Hero's hunting efficiency by changing the function of Combo Force. However, we realized that it was more useful before so we reverted the change but removed its Combo cost."

LOL so it's back to normal now, but doesn't require a combo orb. I still dislike the fact that Rage Uprising has a cool down. I rather it not have a cool down but take away a portion of our hp or mp (like how dragon roar originally was). Or maybe allow it to attack on either side of the character? Moving monsters into position is hard enough at strong hold with everyone attacking them, and then you have to put darkness over them and get them all back into range to attack. It's really inefficient with our relatively short range.[/quote]

Since Raging Blow is a mobbing skill, we will not even get that 25% boost from Chance Attack most of the time. If we have the chance to panic something, we might as well use raging blow for the better damage since the target(s) is/are not far away.

[quote=GeneralStore]They just need more HPS or a damage cap increase, imo.[/quote]

I like this idea. The problem with more HPS is that warriors should not be hitting that quickly. I would love to see much fewer lines of damage, like before Big Bang.
Paladins had one line of damage. Heroes had two lines of damage. Dark Knights had three lines of damage. With these lower HPS rates, a raised damage cap would make more sense. Even the blast animation appears to be one hit but somehow does ten lines of damage.

combo force is almost like archers hook shot

quote from orange mushroom (I'm assuming it the developer statement)
"Hero's hunting ability is not very good. This is because they have no way of moving fast across a map. Although we could just increase their damage or skill range, we want to stay true to the Hero's character concept. Therefore, Self Recovery was improved and Rage Uprising's cooldown was reduced to be more helping in hunting."
Combo Force: this skill no longer pulls enemies towards you, it now moves you towards the enemy instead
Self Recovery Self Recovery: HP recovered has been increased from 1000 HP to 1500 HP
Rage Uprising Rage Uprising: cooldown has been decreased from 30 seconds to 10 seconds

No way of moving across a map fast? Heroes already can move fast across a map if you use rush (just use a faster sword, it your choice to have slower movement if you use two-handed sword), the fact that the new combo force doesn't pull the monster with you make this inefficient for training as you have to turn around and kill the monster behind you (rush usually leave a monster behind anyway, while the old combo force almost always pull all monster toward you)

The buff to Self Recovery was needed since the decrease of invincibility time and the buff to monster damage (imo i don't think it enough as the decreased invincibility means you take twice the damage now), but it is still useless for a late game hero (Unless there a way to decrease hero max hp at bosses with only %damage attacks)

Rage Uprising is now officially a training skill for multiple platform.

@eolay Any idea what combo force is yet?

@eolay: hah, interestingly, Hero is one of the few classes outside of Resistance that got buffed.

I wonder how hero's 5th job will be.

[quote=eolay]http://www.southperry.net/showthread.php?t=74284

We get some kind of change to Combo Force whatever that is...
Self recovery gets increased from 1000hp to 1500hp
And our hyper skill gets a 10 second cool down instead of a 30 second cool down.

Wtf?[/quote]

have you seen the changes for the other adventurers? they're getting nerfed down to Hero level, Paladin loses elemental reset, and Dark Knights get sacrifice and cross surge nerfed hard also.

[quote=eolay]So um.. like 80% of classes got changed somehow, yet Heroes were left untouched? Why.[/quote]
Because they hate Hero since we have the coolest job name

[quote=Lmaonade200]I agree with the HPS, for an all-in damage type class they hit too little lines per second, lower than both the other adventurer warriors by a good margin actually

lower base damage % and increase lines dealt by 2 or 3 for raging blow and panic would be nice imo[/quote]

I was thinking a ~30% reduction for RB delay as well as an updated animation for it, fixing final attack so it actually hits 60% of the time, chaining together panic-puncture- and rb, and maybe having puncture leave a fire trail on the ground as kaiser and beast tamer skills do. I like many of the ideas in the thread, but I always felt heroes should be a straightforward warrior type character with a focus on damage and good control rather than spells.

[quote=GeneralStore]They just need more HPS or a damage cap increase, imo.[/quote]

I agree with the HPS, for an all-in damage type class they hit too little lines per second, lower than both the other adventurer warriors by a good margin actually

lower base damage % and increase lines dealt by 2 or 3 for raging blow and panic would be nice imo

They just need more HPS or a damage cap increase, imo.

Like what other people said, all Heroes need are

1. A drain skill like most DPSers have
2. some increase in % damage
3. usefully utilities like phys. resistance ignore, bind, etc.

I think Heroes just need a change in the way their damage is calculated, damage% from enrage and from orbs is calculated additively with critical damage, if it were separate, then critical damage would affect damage % from enrage and orbs also, which is the way it should be imo.

After I went ahead and read some mechanics about boss pdr and elemental resistance, I finally understand the problem with hero
So basically, Higher level boss have three separate instance of defense.

The first instance is the regular weapon def which every monster has. This is rather insignificance so I will not talk much about it

The second instance is the infamous PDR. This directly reduce the damage the boss will taken in percentage to our attack.
However, as it is still considered a "defense", It can still be bypass by percentage defense ignore,
which some funded player can easily bypass having almost 100% defense ignore.

The third instance is the elemental resistance of the boss.
The word elemental is quite misleading, as higher tier boss do not only resist to magical element (ice, fire, etc)
but also the physical element (aka the normal physical attack). This is considered to be a "resistance" rather than "defense"
which is the reason why defense ignore has no effect on it.

Usually magician has a skill called elemental reset which make their elemental magic considered to be a "neutral" element which can bypass these "resistance"
however paladin has the skill void element which is a self buff which cause all of his attack to ignore 100% of "resistance" including the physical element resistance.
This means that paladin with 100% defense ignore will deal 100% damage to the boss as the third instance of defense of the boss has no effect on paladin while it will unavoidably affect all other physical class.

Td;dr - Pally is OP nerf pls nexon

I'm thinking more damage in RB and a better recovery (maybe 5% instead of 1000/200)
Also more range in shout

[quote=blackicon]I think hero theme should stuck on "1vs1 DPSer" and that's it. Full stop.
I don't want buff in our mobbling skill, should give that to DrK
Our passive recovery should stay as it is, Hero is not meant to be tank and gobble down pots has been part of Hero life
Heck I don't even want fancy stuff that make us ignore DR or anything, we are not pally.
Just buff the brute power while sliding in something to work with our orbs.
Here's my suggestion:
Enrage: Damage bonus increase from 60%-->100%
Raging Blow: Base multipier +20% and number of hit +1 when enrage
Panic: No change outside enrage. When enrage, turns into a fury of attack, hit the enemy 9 times with 300% dmg while applying debuff to them. Each time panic is used consecutively, it consumes one extra orb and grant bonus attack up to 20% when 10orbs are used.
This way we deal more dmg to boss while have to constantly apply buff to ourself using panic and orbs.[/quote]

Enrage at 100% well kinda overpowered and people will complain about it, Panic is a useful finisher move and add in chance attack but I kinda disagree with hitting enemy 9 times 300% damage while applying debuff since panic without enrage on can hit mobs so technically whats the point of hitting 9*300% since the time it takes to use the orbs could deal more damage in that time frame with using raging blow, what about increasing raging blow's % damage base since its at 258% without enrage on but +10% damage to it when enrage is on

I think hero theme should stuck on "1vs1 DPSer" and that's it. Full stop.
I don't want buff in our mobbling skill, should give that to DrK
Our passive recovery should stay as it is, Hero is not meant to be tank and gobble down pots has been part of Hero life
Heck I don't even want fancy stuff that make us ignore DR or anything, we are not pally.
Just buff the brute power while sliding in something to work with our orbs.
Here's my suggestion:
Enrage: Damage bonus increase from 60%-->100%
Raging Blow: Base multipier +20% and number of hit +1 when enrage
Panic: No change outside enrage. When enrage, turns into a fury of attack, hit the enemy 9 times with 300% dmg while applying debuff to them. Each time panic is used consecutively, it consumes one extra orb and grant bonus attack up to 20% when 10orbs are used.
This way we deal more dmg to boss while have to constantly apply buff to ourself using panic and orbs.

I feel really bad because I'm uhh... reasonably happy with Hero as it is now. The only thing I'd really want is a drain on attack skill since the passive HP Recovery really doesn't cut it. Not sure where it'd go though. Mounting drain on CA? Maybe on Enrage? Problem with that is then it feels silly not having access to it until 4th job... I'd just like some way I could go for broke and keep hitting stuff instead of stopping to hp pot literally every 3 seconds. Also, godknows why they removed Coma. The MM->Coma->RB combo felt beautifully smooth to me. OK I know it doesn't work on miniboss mobs (Which is literally every mob lategame) but 100% stunning and killing mobs was just great for saving some bloody HP Pots. I quite like Combo Fury but going from that straight into RB doesn't feel very fluid at all (Always seems delayed to me). And the supposed '3 second' stun duration doesn't even feel close to that. And what am I supposed to use to extend it? Shout? Come on.

So yeah, some sort of a drain and a reliable stunning skill would please me no end. Though I admit some of you guys' ideas are really cool. But I like to keep things reasonable haha.

There needs to be some sort of draining skill imo. Also for the love of god change rb's animation </3

[quote=David0696]I hate shout. It should have remained a Dark Knight thing. I do see how Paladins have threaten, Dark Knights have dragon roar, and how Heroes have shout. It does us no good, however. I would prefer a bigger range on the skill, or maybe even giving an effect to a monster (bosses, too) that lets the party ignore some elemental resist. Dawn Warriors have something like this too, on their bind, if I have heard correctly from my friend.[/quote]

Roar is dead, as it stands we're on the same path as heroes regarding it, we'd rather have the skill (or the leftover empty dead husk that remains) go and never come back.

roar was good, stupid beholder screech just sucks.

guys.

or bring back defense for paladin and nerf them and return hero back to their spotlight.

I believe the slash/stab ratio was something like 105%/85% for axes. Swords had 100%/100%. Overall, the swords were better, obviously.
[quote=Rexaar]
Puncture: Enemies Hit: 6, Damage: 576%, Number of Attacks: 3. For 30 sec, attacked enemies will take 165% damage at every 2 sec at 100% chance. ?Enemy will take 20% more critical damage. When a party member attacks, increases by 10%
Critical hit doesn't scale well with heroes huge damage multiplier, and the dot is completely useless since it doesn't scale with both damage multiplier and boss/total damage. Otherwise it is a great party buff for classes with high crit rates, but solo wise, it a bit lacking.[/quote]
I am happy someone realizes how little Puncture helps, except when in a party. You are right about the heroes damage multiplier. From orbs alone, we get +120% damage. On Enrage, if our minCrit is +35% and our maxCrit is +50%, criticals barely do anything for us. Instead of having an interval of (+297%, +330%) damage boost from critical hits and orbs, we only get (+255%, +270%). [b]Our critical damage boost is additive with our boost from orbs.[/b]

[quote=eolay]
Tbh I prefer minimal lines (talking like 2 or 3 hits like pre-bb), and not super fast speed. Just crazy high numbers. If you look at the anime and animated intros, they attack slow but hard. fast attacking speed should be a thief's domain.
But that's just my opinion.[/quote]
Honestly, I prefer this too. However, the 50m damage cap is in the way. Right now there are heroes hitting 50m on six lines. The only way to squish 300m damage into two lines of damage would be to have a damage cap of 150m. I wish that could happen but it will not.
Warriors look weird with so many lines of damage. This looks even worse for Paladins, who hit ten times from one Blast "attack".

[quote=NiseMidi]
I don't want our class to become some class-hybrid. Something that appealed Heroes for me is from how incredibly basic it is to play them. Also, we should ALWAYS chug pots. That's like....a part of our thing. We can't just not chug 300 bottles of Reindeer Milk in one minute. It's mandatory. Also, we need to be Ultimate Offense to contrast the Pally's Ultimate Defense, while the Dark Knight (lel) should be the middle-approach.[/quote]
I agree with this. Heroes are an offensive class, although they do not appear to look like one now. If someone does not want to drain pots, they should play another job, maybe a defensive class, maybe Paladin or Dark Knight.
Also, a +ATT% based skill would upset some because it would be additive with their +%ATT on equips. We already do have orbs which multiply our damage. Perhaps something can be implemented there.

[quote=LoveDocABC]
Shout, (tiger skill) is a useless even with better damage. Don't bother revamping it. Just remove it completely and add a new skill.
[/quote]
I hate shout. It should have remained a Dark Knight thing. I do see how Paladins have threaten, Dark Knights have dragon roar, and how Heroes have shout. It does us no good, however. I would prefer a bigger range on the skill, or maybe even giving an effect to a monster (bosses, too) that lets the party ignore some elemental resist. Dawn Warriors have something like this too, on their bind, if I have heard correctly from my friend.

@Rexaar, I looked at your video and I miss the sound of Brandish. Your study on AFA is very interesting. I had not realized we had a problem with it.

@Rexaar: yea, your video is made perfectly indeed, that must suck.

for us DrK we don't even account FA in our calcs anymore, it only triggers on small range and all our attacks have massive range (plus they attack faster than the chance for FA to trigger, that might be a thing in your numbers too actually, lag between FA triggering and actually activating)

[quote=darkspawn980]PD: deleted my heroes but you might want to check the glitch with AFA isn't because you're too far from the mob, on my DrK i have to be within FA range for FA to trigger and that's one small range.[/quote]

I'm aware that FA has it own attack range for certain skills (slashblast, brandish, intrepid slash), just that raging blow get the special treatment of FA copying the attack range of raging blow.
Here a video detailing the Final attack glitch.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PvP2YFxYcIE
Summery:
A total of 463 attacks were used.
Only 61 Final Attack were seen activated.
Which is only 13% activation rate out of 463 attacks.
Submitted a bug report on this to Nexon forum today.

@kenishi21: potato explosion went the same way, it's only use now is to clear trash mobs

@eolay: oh, you're going into fourth job territory, and if you check the guide or the numbers i posted, you'll see that swords didn't have a slash/stab difference. but even the guidemaker (the one about weapon comparisons) says, and i quote:

[quote=guide]Dragon Knights' become the most stable during Third Job, when using the appropriate attacks, but often fail to KB with spears, since each attack deals 3 hits that are slightly weaker than a WK or Crusader's Slashblast with their boosts on. This is one of the reasons Dragon Knights have an obsessive need for Priests (the other being no Powerguard). This is a primary reason why all dragon knights should be hybrid and train with polearms until they move from himes to 3-enemy mobs.[/quote]

i'm having a good time reliving the past here.

but yea, once 4th job came out dark knights became second place warrior to hero, since hero got a better attack and 200% damage without the need to be under half HP.

@eolay: slash stab difference was pretty big actually, it could seriously hamper your damage, the thing was that swords did equal damage with either i think it was, while axes were better for slash and bad for stabs (which is why nobody used them except hipsters, because the damage difference was noticeable)

that's why dark knights were the stablest class, they could take advantage of always, every time, getting the bonus for slash or for stab, depending on the skill they used.

edit: links, man i'm going to cry, the nostalgia.
http://www.basilmarket.com/MapleStory-Guide-How-To-Choose-Your-Warrior-Weapon-230.html
http://www.basilmarket.com/forum/1190005/0/The_Complete_Hybrid_DK_Guide.html

minimum damage
1-handed sword: (STR 4.0 0.9 Mastery + DEX) W ATT/100
2-handed sword: (STR 4.6 0.9 Mastery + DEX) W ATT/100
1-handed axe or BW: (STR 4.4 0.9 Mastery + DEX) W ATT/100 (On Swing)
1-handed axe or BW: (STR 3.2 0.9 Mastery + DEX) W ATT/100 (On Stab)
Spear: (STR 3.0 0.9 Mastery + DEX) W ATT/100 (On Swing)
Spear: (STR 5.0 0.9 Mastery + DEX) W ATT/100 (On Stab)
Polearm: (STR 5.0 0.9 Mastery + DEX) W ATT/100 (On Swing)
Polearm: (STR 3.0 0.9 Mastery + DEX) W ATT/100 (On Stab)

so percentage wise, a DrK's damage was as stable as a hero.

@eolay: 2. Noooo Heroes must be stronger. Stronger! Though when you look at Bams, they get 75% damage from dark aura and 6 attack speed with yellow aura. I think a Hero would look like the kind of guy who would throw out hundreds of fast flashy attacks to look cool >.>

3. Yea Raging Blow looks pretty crap, but at least it doesn't look like actual crap (looking at you dimple). In my opinion, the enraged version of a Raging Blow with a sword looks sexy. In my opinion, increasing the damage cap has made it ridiculously hard to tell someone's damage, since the lines pile on top of each other and disappear ridiculously fast. I can never tell if somebody is doing 700k or 7mil. The only way I can differentiate is by seeing how fast the monsters die. The problem is that there are a select few people who are able to fund the crap out of their classes and reach the cap. Still, Raging Blow animation should hit 3 times.

Now,using potions while attacking. One of the luxuries of people with key down skills the fact that Heroes have to chug potions lowers their damage output by an insane amount. Even with auto pet, there is a delay when your pet uses a pot...

@eolay: why did i get quoted?

also, it wasn't crusaders who had the most stable damage, it was dragon knights due to the fact we could control our stab/slash ratio. dunno how good panic was for single-line damage but it was a terrible skill back then, dragon roar was -THE- skill (looked cool plus was useful)

@Kazzooey: according to joetang charts, 1v1, hypers, no SE or buff duration, 0% PDR and boss:

hero: 19139%/s
DrK: 16679%/s

that's quite the difference clean, which is why i said heroes don't scale well.

http://www.southperry.net/showthread.php?t=47548
reference thread.

Now that I think about it, the theme of Heroes should be perseverance. The longer you fight, the more you are rewarded. The combo orbs seem like a perfect example for your theme, since as you continue to attack, your damage increases. Problem is, the rewards from your combo orbs are kind of crap. It takes ten orbs to reach maximum charges, and after fully charging the ten orbs, you get the same damage increase as a dark knight who just pressed one button for crossover chains o.o granted we still have to keep our hp up.

They could possibly put more orbs into your charges. Heck lumis have a skill that charges up to 30 times ant their attack speed is so atrocious that it takes forever to charge. How about 7.5% damage per orb, 20 orbs. So you get rewarded less when you charge up only 10 orbs, but you get a massive 150% damage with 20 orbs up. Another advantage of 20 combo orbs is that using up a combo orb will be less negative on your damage output since you only lose 7.5% per orb as opposed to 10%.

Also for some reason, the Bams have been talking about reaching negative attack speeds. I thought even with green pot attack speed had a hard cap of fast(0) if you can reach negative attack speeds though. I think every 5 combo orbs should increase your attack speed by one, plus being able to break the attack speed cap like the green potion.

So at 20 orbs, you get 150% damage and 4 stags of attack speed. Seems pretty decent for a specialised skill.

Now for raging blow. I've just realised that demon avenger's exceed system is excactly what a Hero's theme should be, after casting their main attack 5 times, it upgrades into a stronger version, increasing its attack speed and lines.

Raging Blow- Starts off at 200%x4. Every 5 casts, raging blow will upgrade, increasing number of lines by 1, damage per line by 10% (multiplicative!) and also gives 100% crit chance on another line, stacking up to 20 attacks, so at max without hypers, it would be ~290%x8, with 4 of those being guaranteed crits. Again, starts off slow and gets stronger as you persevere. As for how long the buffed up raging blow will last for until it resets back to level 1. Let's be Nexon and make it the same as DA's exceed skills.

Now I know you heroes are appalled at your crappy recovery, so how about remake recovery to fit into your theme of combo orbs? While your hp is below 100%, every 2 seconds, consume 1 combo orb to recover 5% of your BASE hp. Making it less effecting to get hp boosting items and skills, and just go for pure raw damage (Or defence, but if you do that you are ruining your theme and you should feel ashamed).

This also gives you a reason to keep attacking or else you lose all your damage

That's all I can pull out of my arse for a Hero upgrade. The thing I love most about maple is fantasising about revamps that would never occur, but it's still fun to imagine.

@darkspawn980 Hero's are not the strongest. DrK with no %Buff Duration has a slightly higher DPS than Hero iirc.
In raw, brute damage it goes DrK > Hero > Paladin
In practicality it goes Paladin > DrK > Hero

@iChosenDream: that took a lot of posts
and threads
and koreans raging
and quitting

@Rexaar: good, a hero that knows, heroes (the class, but some people too) had been pissing me off for ages because they were the best warriors since pretty much post 4th job, then pally took over for a moment and back to heroes

PD: deleted my heroes but you might want to check the glitch with AFA isn't because you're too far from the mob, on my DrK i have to be within FA range for FA to trigger and that's one small range.

@Kazzooey: heroes are still the strongest... they just don't scale well, too much brute strength doesn't help so they end up failing at the hardest bosses.

@kenishi21: wild archers suck and i haven't seen one since 2013. and that guy wants less lines but ramping up the damage to keep it stable, to be honest i don't get why a spear i throw randomly pops 8 lines of damage.

PD: we had our own version of combo orbs back then too, it was called berzerk and was 1.8x damage ._.

[quote=WhoaMomma1]Here we go, another stupid Hero complaining. If you don't wanna chug potions change the stupid class or fund yourself more. Heroes used to be fun, had variety of skills to spam now it's so sht and basic/boring.. And about Dark Knight/Paladins invincible, it's always been the useless Hero chugging potions to begin with in-fact they're the only Warrior without an invincibility, also no one needs Rage anymore.. People prefer HB or CO, over a measly 30 weapon attack.. They used to be good, now outclassed by the other 2 better ask for a revamp! If you love your useless class and having 'fun' with it, stop complaining.. Get over yourself and face the fact that Heroes are sht >.< If Nexon actually changed Hero's skills a bit more make it more appealing and not cancerous, maybe it'd be good. It's like you're spamming 2nd job all over again with more numbers, and what not the most boring buffs.. Iron Will, Booster, with a toggle Combo Attack (used to be buff) and MW ooh so fun.. *sarcasm*[/quote]

Just curious, where do you live?

@LoveDocABC: I'm saying that's the point. Hero's are underpowered at the moment. And their whole theme revolves around anger, power, and speed. Instead of just increasing the numbers and turning all the skills into 45 liners, increase the attack speed drastically. That would totally fit their theme and still create a great feel. Button mash rage sounds perfect for a Hero on Enrage that's tearing a boss to pieces.

Overpowered? It's a Hero, they're SUPPOSED to be overpowered. It's one of the classes in the game that people are happy about being overpowered...... its a HERO! lol

[quote=Kazzooey]A Hero change is simple.

[*]Rage from 30 ATT -> 40 ATT + 1 ATT Speed
[*]Brandish, Intrepid, and Raging Blow get more animations. As you hold down the key it goes randomly through those animations, each animation having different lines, damage, and attributes to help vary the gameplay. These are your sort of "basic attack" skills for the majority of your combo buildups/mobbing/sustaining.
[*]Panic gets overhauled and turns into a long-stringed combo that dishes out fast and high damage output against MANY targets but eats through your orbs quickly. Still has it's current effects.
[*]The Tiger skill (Can't believe I forgot what it's called) gets higher damage and range, essentially turning into Dragon Roar for Hero's.
[*]Pierce also gets the same overhual as Panic while retaining it's effects. Difference is that Pierce hits only 4 targets but hits slower, higher damage than even Panic. Also ignores ALL defense
[*]Enrage works mostly the same way. But it increases your range by +20%, increases attack Speed by +2 and turns all skills into "Button Mash" skills to where you need to press rather fast to keep up to your maximum damage potential. Hope you don't get too tired.

Seems to fix all the balancing issues while making Hero's fit their theme better and play way cooler.[/quote]

I also thought about having brandish, intrepid, and raging blow stack on top of eachother. Are you thinking of it like Kanna, where each upgrades eachother?

Shout, (tiger skill) is a useless even with better damage. Don't bother revamping it. Just remove it completely and add a new skill.

Ps. Too much speed for heroes. thats like -2 enrage, -1, rage, -2 booster. The fact that swords are normal speed makes it overpowered.

[quote=Billakid]This post will not get you a revamp o-o[/quote]

I don't know man, look at Dark Knights

As much as I love heroes being the king of the explorer warriors. It was time for other class to shine since we were the best for a very very very long time.
Heck, if Nexon releases a high tier boss that isn't physical resistance, it would make me giddy in joy knowing that heroes has the advantage over it, though why the developers still make boss physical resistant when they clearly proven they can break the old hp cap of 2.1 bil is beyond me
Though imo the following skills is flawed for heroes.

Puncture: Enemies Hit: 6, Damage: 576%, Number of Attacks: 3. For 30 sec, attacked enemies will take 165% damage at every 2 sec at 100% chance. ?Enemy will take 20% more critical damage. When a party member attacks, increases by 10%
Critical hit doesn't scale well with heroes huge damage multiplier, and the dot is completely useless since it doesn't scale with both damage multiplier and boss/total damage. Otherwise it is a great party buff for classes with high crit rates, but solo wise, it a bit lacking.

Combat mastery: Level 1: Defense Ignored: 21%, Level 30: Defense Ignored: 50%
The skill is fine, as 50% defense ignored is huge compared to smaller but more numerous defense ignore that other classes has (no hyper skill SP wasted). It just the way the skill scale with SP points, 1% per level is bit too underwhelming. Perhaps an additional effect could be added onto to skill.

Advanced Final Attack: No problem here except for the glitch where the activation rate is too low (on average 20 hits out of 100 activate AFA)

As a warrior class that designed that YOLO everything, the following idea would contribute to the YOLOness.
-a skill that decrease damage output by 40% but cuts all attacking skill delay in half which mean you attack two times faster, which mean you can stop attacking much earlier and dodge attacks much sooner and avoid those OHKO attacks on pure micro skills

im still a hero but i dont play much anymore honestly so idc

@Billakid we're just discussing what we think

This post will not get you a revamp o-o

well, i would not want survivabillity because the reason why paladin is op is because they have the best defense and best bossing skill (elemental ignore thing)
So they should take that away from paladin, and make hero full out bossing class. Have some decent mobbing skills for 2nd and 3rd. Then only bossing skills for 4th (some godly ones) That will balance them. Back in the days, we were good at bossing at higher lv but was really annoying to train. So nexon should keep the same concept but improve our bossing skills.

[quote=Kazzooey]A Hero change is simple.

[*]Rage from 30 ATT -> 40 ATT + 1 ATT Speed
[*]Brandish, Intrepid, and Raging Blow get more animations. As you hold down the key it goes randomly through those animations, each animation having different lines, damage, and attributes to help vary the gameplay. These are your sort of "basic attack" skills for the majority of your combo buildups/mobbing/sustaining.
[*]Panic gets overhauled and turns into a long-stringed combo that dishes out fast and high damage output against MANY targets but eats through your orbs quickly. Still has it's current effects.
[*]The Tiger skill (Can't believe I forgot what it's called) gets higher damage and range, essentially turning into Dragon Roar for Hero's.
[*]Pierce also gets the same overhual as Panic while retaining it's effects. Difference is that Pierce hits only 4 targets but hits slower, higher damage than even Panic. Also ignores ALL defense
[*]Enrage works mostly the same way. But it increases your range by +20%, increases attack Speed by +2 and turns all skills into "Button Mash" skills to where you need to press rather fast to keep up to your maximum damage potential. Hope you don't get too tired.

Seems to fix all the balancing issues while making Hero's fit their theme better and play way cooler.[/quote]

I liked the idea except for the last one, why would they decrease the % from enrage by 40 -.-
and turn us into some kind of aran hybrid when we focus on ONE single mob....
seems like a rather stupid move
But hey, that's just how i see it

A Hero change is simple.

[*]Rage from 30 ATT -> 40 ATT + 1 ATT Speed
[*]Brandish, Intrepid, and Raging Blow get more animations. As you hold down the key it goes randomly through those animations, each animation having different lines, damage, and attributes to help vary the gameplay. These are your sort of "basic attack" skills for the majority of your combo buildups/mobbing/sustaining.
[*]Panic gets overhauled and turns into a long-stringed combo that dishes out fast and high damage output against MANY targets but eats through your orbs quickly. Still has it's current effects.
[*]The Tiger skill (Can't believe I forgot what it's called) gets higher damage and range, essentially turning into Dragon Roar for Hero's.
[*]Pierce also gets the same overhual as Panic while retaining it's effects. Difference is that Pierce hits only 4 targets but hits slower, higher damage than even Panic. Also ignores ALL defense
[*]Enrage works mostly the same way. But it increases your range by +20%, increases attack Speed by +2 and turns all skills into "Button Mash" skills to where you need to press rather fast to keep up to your maximum damage potential. Hope you don't get too tired.

Seems to fix all the balancing issues while making Hero's fit their theme better and play way cooler.