General

[quote=iTempo]@Shroomsly: Welcome back. Unless of course you're just here for a good laugh and memories sake[/quote]

[url=http://gifatron.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/OaG3aqi.gif]Thanks. :L[/url]
But yeah, I'm more or less just here for the maplestory information, believe it or not. Just kind of intrigued by this deputy thing.

[quote=iTempo]@Shroomsly weren't you a moderator back in the day?[/quote]

I guess, yeah. I think that was like 3~5 years ago.

[quote=Yumtoast]If I recall correctly, there was a sheriff that mentioned evading suspension doesn't necessarily make a good mod (or deputy, in this case), and I'd have to agree.[/quote]

I think there was a mod who even suspended himself on occasion.
@kevvl I think?

[quote=BobR]Dropped considerably, probably proportional to the drop in the Maplestory base.
A little like the Spruce Goose, it would have worked, but the war seems to be ending prematurely.[/quote]

Hmm. I am honestly a bit surprised. Basilmarket always seemed to have a strong core for its fanbase. I haven't been on here in a while, since I only used it for game information. Still seems about the same, even considering the decrease in users.

[quote=Shroomsly]Hmm. I wasn't exactly expecting this much of a response. Just curious, what's a decent estimate of the population size/identity of basilmarket now versus it's size/identity at the time of this idea's conception?[/quote]

Dropped considerably, probably proportional to the drop in the Maplestory base.
A little like the Spruce Goose, it would have worked, but the war seems to be ending prematurely.

Hmm. I wasn't exactly expecting this much of a response. Just curious, what's a decent estimate of the population size/identity of basilmarket now versus it's size/identity at the time of this idea's conception?

it's really interesting that this feature is finally coming to life because its first conception was around 2009 when there was some event (I think it was some bot spamming threads or extremely long posts to extend the page) that led to a thread and IRC room called 'basilmarket thinktank'. basically it was this large brainstorm of possible changes to the system, and I suggested this idea of the trash section where reported threads/posts would go in the trash for mod review and could be retrieved by mods if the reports were false. basically it was the deputy system. people in the chat seemed to like the idea (including the then current mods) but the implementation of this system never seemed to happen probably because of different priorities. at this point, the potential change the deputy system could bring has expired because the size of the population doesn't necessitate this kind of system.

I'm excited to know that a few other people actually care about the well-being of this website. To my knowledge, Deputy system is still not fully implemented as I have seen ZERO hidden posts so far. I'm working on getting some answers about how it works / when it will be finalized. Til then, makes no sense to criticize a system that technically doesn't exist yet.

@mitarumetaro: I'm all for self-moderation, but I have very little faith in our community.

I want reports back as much as you do, however, I don't trust future deputies to make logical decisions. For some people, there's a thin line between posts that are against the rules, and posts they simply don't like.

The mods always seem to be on some vacation.

[quote=Yumtoast]I agree, but having a report button does nothing if you have no mods[/quote]

With the deputy system, APPARENTLY if a post gets a certain number of reports, it is automatically hidden pending mod review.

Many months ago, I suggested that it be taken one step further, and that a user with a certain number of hidden posts be automatically blocked from posting pending mod review.

But the point is, you can't have user moderation unless the users actually have the ability to do so. And without a report button, most of us don't.

[quote=mitarumetaro]...I still think that the only sensible way to have users self-moderating the forums is to give every user a freaking report button, but that's just me...[/quote]
I agree, but having a report button does nothing if you have no mods

...I still think that the only sensible way to have users self-moderating the forums is to give every user a freaking report button, but that's just me...

Nevermind.

[quote=BobR]Do you have any specific recommendations..?
This normally isn't discussed in public because it usually just invites trolling and pages of "meMeME!"[/quote]
I don't. Almost every forum I frequent uses the same method of finding new mods: have staff review users' report and post history to choose a candidate(s), and it's a good way of finding decent people in the long run. Deputies/sheriffs shouldn't be appointed if their posts are too low-quality and their reports too rare. It's always terrible for a community to have unfit law enforcement, plus Mr. B isn't the type to remove people from power quickly or reverse a bad decision; just look at how long it took for him to revoke EeveePony's status or consolidate all those entertainment subforums.

Though if there are still any users that had an accurate report history before the function disappeared and still participates in the forums (not sporadically), I would consider him/her. That actually sounds highly improbable, so maybe Mr. B should just bring back reports back and we can take baby steps from there. But knowing his administrative habits, he won't give up on the deputy system and we'll have it as long as the site exists. If that's the case, the order of events should be: introduce deputy system -> don't appoint any deputies -> monitor users who make good reports and decent posts -> hire them as deputies -> if they do a good job, hire them as mods

Skipping that third step is a bad idea. Also it's quite easy to not be suspended if you're only posting a few times per week. This site needs mods that are willing to invest a decent amount of time.

[quote=Yumtoast]Oh wait, there are no mod candidates because not only has the report function been dead for God knows how long, our current mods aren't active enough to monitor those who would make a great sheriff.[/quote]

Do you have any specific recommendations..?
This normally isn't discussed in public because it usually just invites trolling and pages of "meMeME!"

Your observation about how to choose moderators IS how it has been done historically, but as you said, Reporting has been a little "wonky" lately.
However, anyone who qualifies for Deputy status (and the Report button) meets at least the requirement about not being suspended, which in itself implies a good understanding of the rules. The quality of their reporting is something that will have to be observed over time.

This feature would have been fantastic 3 or 4 years ago when traffic was high, but it's way too late now. The better option would be to hire/vote-in one or two more [i]active[/i] mods instead of a group of wannabe sheriffs patrolling a forum that can't even manage a few hundred posts a day. Oh wait, there are no mod candidates because not only has the report function been dead for God knows how long, our current mods aren't active enough to monitor those who would make a great sheriff. So instead of just hiring a mod quickly, we're going to go through this stupidly roundabout method that involves possibly killing off what little posters we have left. If I recall correctly, there was a sheriff that mentioned evading suspension doesn't necessarily make a good mod (or deputy, in this case), and I'd have to agree. I'd much prefer having deputies be appointed based on how accurate their report history AND how little they've been suspended -- but that's impossible when no one has been able to send a report in months.

There's a time and place for everything, and the deputy system ship has sailed. Remember when Mr. B implemented Basil Mobile in ~2010, but with a 2007 mobile interface? Remember how quickly that died off?

edit: wow, I just noticed how unpopular my opinion is

[quote=mitarumetaro]AKA a report button[/quote]

That's kind of how it's looking atm.
While I was thinking about my post above, it occurred to me the requirements for both are rather coincidental.

Oooh. Righty-o. Neat. I'm remembering that idea now. Hope it comes to fruition.

[quote=BobR]@Shroomsly a higher priority "Report" function[/quote]

AKA a report button

it has been in progress for almost 2 years

I think the deputy system has the opportunity to be absolutely fantastic. I really hope this works out so we can help clean up the messes that are created.

^ oh, good. fwew. there was people gettin mad at getting suspended, while others got away with worse posts and threads. good to see it will "eventually" seem fair.

@Shroomsly Mr. Basil has been working on a system where Basil users who've shown the ability to follow the rules can help the site with a higher priority "Report" function. If 3 or more Deputies report the same thread or post it will be removed from public view until a Moderator has a chance to review it, so things like spam attacks (or worse) during times when there aren't any Mods online won't sit in plain view overnight.