General

[quote=shyally]That's actually a really interesting perspective.

I do remember running around Maple Island begging people for help because I had no idea what I was doing

I think this issue can be solved by updating the current game though. We can keep the quick-quests until level 10, but after that there should be PQs that give plenty of EXP to be just as good or better than training solo.

It would also be interesting if every PQ was cross-world everyday. Of course, they need to be instanced as well. I think that would help bring people together again.[/quote]

The upper level limit for PQs have been removed, so there's no feeling of teamwork if the team effort is one sided.

[quote=iElmo]What I mean by a better community is that in the past, there were more ways to get to know people around your level. Remember when you would make a new character in Maple Island and you and another person would be friend each other just because? These days, you don't really meet anyone until level 50 or higher when (or if) you start doing PQs and even then, people don't really talk to each other since a lot of the people leveling around 50-120 seem to be link skill mules. After 120+, you're once again mostly solo training (or perhaps still PQing) and you probably won't see another player until 160 if you decide to train in a party at MP3.[/quote]

That's actually a really interesting perspective.

I do remember running around Maple Island begging people for help because I had no idea what I was doing

I think this issue can be solved by updating the current game though. We can keep the quick-quests until level 10, but after that there should be PQs that give plenty of EXP to be just as good or better than training solo.

It would also be interesting if every PQ was cross-world everyday. Of course, they need to be instanced as well. I think that would help bring people together again.

[quote=PandaPoet]ya but an old Maple server is like a separate source of revenue to the main game. unless you are saying that people will quit the main game and only play old Maple instead.[/quote]

That's the possibility Nexon would be concerned about... lots of people abandoning the "pay to win" concept of Maplestory now and going back to the "NX is for appearance items only" scheme they used to have. In other words, people buying sunglasses for $3.00 instead of packs and packs of Miracle Cubes for $100s of dollars.

Sure there would be people still willing to put hundreds of dollars into improving their pretend weapons and damage, but I'm guessing as more and more people discovered they could still have fun playing the game without spending that kind of money the flow of players would continue non-stop to the "Pre-BB" server.

The whole point of and Old Maple Server is to bring back the whole old community, and teaching those who are new the way we were back before Big Bang. It was more fun and the community is way better. You may be thinking, the Post Big Bang community might move over, but they'll also learn the Pre-BB way, because we used each other to get to the top, not money.

[quote=BobR]Doesn't matter. Separate pre-BB server or just rolling the game back to pre-BB completely.
Their revenue stream would dry up, thus no chance of it ever happening.[/quote]

ya but an old Maple server is like a separate source of revenue to the main game. unless you are saying that people will quit the main game and only play old Maple instead.

[quote=PandaPoet]you were talking about a separate pre bb server lol.[/quote]

Doesn't matter. Separate pre-BB server or just rolling the game back to pre-BB completely.
Their revenue stream would dry up, thus no chance of it ever happening.

[quote=BobR]Going back to pre-BB would mean giving up that revenue stream, and Nexon -never- gives up a nickle on anything.[/quote]

you were talking about a separate pre bb server lol.

@Degeneration Nexon will -never- release a permanent "pre-BB" server.
The entire reason for the BB changes (and all the changes since then) have been to MONETIZE the game to the nth degree.
Going back to pre-BB would mean giving up that revenue stream, and Nexon -never- gives up a nickle on anything.

[quote=shyally]Everyone seems to be saying the old Maple community was so great... it wasn't. I have so many memories of getting scammed or being rudely treated. No idea what you guys are talking about.

I recall one time I managed to get into a Party at Himes with this DK. I was a level 9x priest at the time. Not very high, but high enough to get by. I did a good job healing him and luring the monsters toward him. I worked pretty hard. Then after like 1 hour, a level 10x Priest showed up and the DK just kicked me without warning. I could only withstand 2 hits, so this surprised/distracted me long enough to cause me to die... I lost all the exp I earned training, and then some more.

Putting specific experiences like that aside, are you guys forgetting about:
- rampant use of auto-clickers to steal Party Quest maps
- all sorts of weird scams in the FM entrance. E.x. two people working together S> junk 100k with another guy on the other end of the map B> junk 1m
- KSers. KSers everywhere. It was so bad that I decided to train at the end of the Kerning Subway JQs.

The community was not that great.

Now, I'll grant there were also fun times. Training in a large party in the Ant tunnel was pretty interesting... but I have my "fun times" in new Maple as well. It's easier than ever to find someone to boss with, thanks to the Alliance system and Boss Queue. In old Maple, I'd have to spam J> pap for an hour or so before I finally managed to get into a party going Papulatous.

In current Maple, scamming is still an issue (NX selling, for example) but at least the KSing problem has gone down a lot, thanks to Party Play.

From my view point, the new community and the old community are pretty much the same. Only real difference is the high-level snobs got replaced by rich snobs, lol. In old Maple there were plenty of high-level snobs... and a bunch that weren't snobs. In new Maple, there are plenty of rich (a.k.a. people who hit cap) snobs, and a bunch that aren't snobs.

Or are you also forgetting about all the sins in old Maple that love showing off their damage? The community hasn't changed.
I think it's pretty hard to argue Maple isn't pay2win. It takes hundreds, maybe even upwards of a thousand, cubes to actually make gear good enough to kill the "end-game" bosses.

By old Maple standards, everybody is OP right now... but being OP is no longer good enough to kill bosses, even in a team of 6.[/quote]

What I mean by a better community is that in the past, there were more ways to get to know people around your level. Remember when you would make a new character in Maple Island and you and another person would be friend each other just because? These days, you don't really meet anyone until level 50 or higher when (or if) you start doing PQs and even then, people don't really talk to each other since a lot of the people leveling around 50-120 seem to be link skill mules. After 120+, you're once again mostly solo training (or perhaps still PQing) and you probably won't see another player until 160 if you decide to train in a party at MP3.

I did precisely say in a previous post that most people are sensationilizing the old MS, most likely due to nostalgia. I don't miss how slow the customer support was, how hard it was to even get to 3rd job, how Zakum was pretty much monopolized by certain guilds/people, etc.

To a post above, I think you are really overestimating Maple's ability to recruit people to the game. An old MS may spark interest but it's not going to create any long-term commitments. A lot of people who are currently playing MS have invested a lot of money and aren't simply going to throw it all away to lose out on all their funding, levels, and damage.

I'm going to argue that the divide (including communication) between the funded and unfunded in the current state of Maple is lower. There has always been a divide between the funded and the unfunded and in the past, being funded granted you a lot more privileges and benefits (kind of like how the world works, huh?). Being funded now only means that you'll be able to kill certain bosses faster but for what? Profitability from bosses is rare which leads to my next point... If you're like the Bill Gates of Maple and you don't really have anything to gain anymore from chump change items then you're most likely going to be more generous and just give them away. People are much more nice now and often give away end-game gear for free. Scrolling them with spell traces isn't difficult and if you are smart with your money during events, you can afford epic potential scrolls and then use boss cubes to try to get a good line. This game isn't as incredibly pay-to-win as people say it is but money sure does save a heck of a lot of time.

You don't need to prime scroll (or even 15%/30%) your items for the best damage. You don't need legendary pot or even unique to be able to do bosses. You don't even need a high range to acquire current end-all equips. The community attitude has to be able to understand that fun is relative, whereas a high damage may be fun to one person, collecting medals or rare items may be fun to another. This game is an MMORPG so you have the ability to do what you want with it and cater it towards your experience.

[quote=iElmo]Again, I highly doubt that most of the community will flock back to GMS or that it will attract new/veteran players. MMORPGs really aren't doing well in this day and age across all games and this trend isn't going to stop even if Nexon releases an "old school server." There also isn't even a high demand for the Old Maple; rather, there's just a bunch of nostalgia that doesn't necessarily translate to the desire for an un-updated server.

People also sensationalize the pre-BB experience and I think what they are forgetting is that most of the experience came from a community and the community attitude. In our current state of the game, we still have access to bossing together, party quests, training but they have all taken different forms since the game has evolved. We lack the community number that MS had years ago and I think that's one of the biggest factors of why this game isn't as fun anymore. This is why I am most looking forward to seeing how the Maple Leaf Council member of Community Life will contribute to the team.[/quote]

[quote=HappyTraderr]A lot of people are missing pre-bb not only because of the nostalgic gameplay and what they did back then, but also because of how the community was back then and how everyone helped each other and how teamwork and party play was something people were actually looking for. Bringing back the old MS or even reverting back to it wont really change much because the community wont be the same as it was back then, the current and evolved MS community is separated into 3 categories nowadays.

1) Elitists who solo all the bosses and gets pissed when the market isn't in their favor.
2) Elitists who do the same as #1 except they giveaway 5 mill CRA gear to boost their ego and pride
3) And the small remaining fraction who actually have tight-knit guilds who help each other out[/quote]

[quote=Flamepc]Take out pay-to-win, rich-vs-poor, and shortcuts. Once they do that, the community will be friendlier.
...[/quote]

[quote=Miauri]Yall know Old MS sucked, right? You only miss it because it was your childhood
The community was better bc everyone was a child[/quote]

Everyone seems to be saying the old Maple community was so great... it wasn't. I have so many memories of getting scammed or being rudely treated. No idea what you guys are talking about.

I recall one time I managed to get into a Party at Himes with this DK. I was a level 9x priest at the time. Not very high, but high enough to get by. I did a good job healing him and luring the monsters toward him. I worked pretty hard. Then after like 1 hour, a level 10x Priest showed up and the DK just kicked me without warning. I could only withstand 2 hits, so this surprised/distracted me long enough to cause me to die... I lost all the exp I earned training, and then some more.

Putting specific experiences like that aside, are you guys forgetting about:
- rampant use of auto-clickers to steal Party Quest maps
- all sorts of weird scams in the FM entrance. E.x. two people working together S> junk 100k with another guy on the other end of the map B> junk 1m
- KSers. KSers everywhere. It was so bad that I decided to train at the end of the Kerning Subway JQs.

The community was not that great.

Now, I'll grant there were also fun times. Training in a large party in the Ant tunnel was pretty interesting... but I have my "fun times" in new Maple as well. It's easier than ever to find someone to boss with, thanks to the Alliance system and Boss Queue. In old Maple, I'd have to spam J> pap for an hour or so before I finally managed to get into a party going Papulatous.

In current Maple, scamming is still an issue (NX selling, for example) but at least the KSing problem has gone down a lot, thanks to Party Play.

From my view point, the new community and the old community are pretty much the same. Only real difference is the high-level snobs got replaced by rich snobs, lol. In old Maple there were plenty of high-level snobs... and a bunch that weren't snobs. In new Maple, there are plenty of rich (a.k.a. people who hit cap) snobs, and a bunch that aren't snobs.

Or are you also forgetting about all the sins in old Maple that love showing off their damage? The community hasn't changed.

[quote=FloorMagnet]I don't understand how Maplestory is pay to win anymore..

I mean nexon is practically spoon-feeding us equips and cubes..[/quote]

I think it's pretty hard to argue Maple isn't pay2win. It takes hundreds, maybe even upwards of a thousand, cubes to actually make gear good enough to kill the "end-game" bosses.

By old Maple standards, everybody is OP right now... but being OP is no longer good enough to kill bosses, even in a team of 6.

[quote=iElmo]Again, I highly doubt that most of the community will flock back to GMS or that it will attract new/veteran players. MMORPGs really aren't doing well in this day and age across all games and this trend isn't going to stop even if Nexon releases an "old school server."[/quote]

That depends on factors such as advertisement. If an "old school" server were to be hosted it may not draw in as many players compared to the past, but it could still be very well be profitable.

[quote=iElmo]There also isn't even a high demand for the Old Maple; rather, there's just a bunch of nostalgia that doesn't necessarily translate to the desire for an un-updated server.[/quote]

Why do you say that, especially when many, many people quit after Big Bang and so you're mostly left with people who like new Maple? If such a server were to be considered, the game's features could be very well updated or new content can be added, much like Old School RuneScape.

[quote=iElmo]People also sensationalize the pre-BB experience and I think what they are forgetting is that most of the experience came from a community and the community attitude. In our current state of the game, we still have access to bossing together, party quests, training but they have all taken different forms since the game has evolved. We lack the community number that MS had years ago and I think that's one of the biggest factors of why this game isn't as fun anymore. This is why I am most looking forward to seeing how the Maple Leaf Council member of Community Life will contribute to the team.[/quote]

Well, you can't replicate past community experience if the current game's features fostered the community you see today, can you now? The game mechanics and environment play an integral role in shaping the goals of the players, their play styles, and general attitudes.

Yall know Old MS sucked, right? You only miss it because it was your childhood
The community was better bc everyone was a child

Bringing back old Maple would be like using a a horse and carriage when a car is available.
You'd like the novelty, but it's just a relic of a dying age.

I don't understand how Maplestory is pay to win anymore..

I mean nexon is practically spoon-feeding us equips and cubes..

[quote=iElmo]Again, I highly doubt that most of the community will flock back to GMS or that it will attract new/veteran players. MMORPGs really aren't doing well in this day and age across all games and this trend isn't going to stop even if Nexon releases an "old school server." There also isn't even a high demand for the Old Maple; rather, there's just a bunch of nostalgia that doesn't necessarily translate to the desire for an un-updated server.

People also sensationalize the pre-BB experience and I think what they are forgetting is that most of the experience came from a community and the community attitude. In our current state of the game, we still have access to bossing together, party quests, training but they have all taken different forms since the game has evolved. We lack the community number that MS had years ago and I think that's one of the biggest factors of why this game isn't as fun anymore. This is why I am most looking forward to seeing how the Maple Leaf Council member of Community Life will contribute to the team.[/quote]

If certain places are brining in more players than stable, reliable servers with constant updates than it's extremely easy to imagine how successful a old school server will be. Oldschool Runecscape brought a vast amount of attention, players, and MONEY to Runescape/Jagex and now has the same population as the current games and even has peaked higher multiple times. Like I don't think you realize how populated the "certain places" I mentioned are despite the numerous problems those things face. They can compete with Scania and sorely outmatch the other gMS servers. and I'm being generous and including the bots/hackers as part of the gMS population, a problem that these servers currently do not face. This is also without these "places" being advertised to your general gaming populace due to the stigma these places have.

MMORPG's are doing fine. All the big name RPG's are still running. Tree of Savior and MS2 are highly anticipated World Wide. The only games that are hurting are games like RS3/MapleStory which went down a horrible path(and Jagex brought back a massive amount of players with the decisions they made in regards to old school). eSports titles are certainly more popular, but games like Maple lost its population because of the mentioned decisions.

>Community attitude

The community attitude was the way it was because of how the game was. You seem knowledgeable and to know a lot about pre-BB. Bossing, party quest, and training all have completely different feelings to them, not to mention a lot of content demands a pay wall or promotes solo play. When you bring back the old way of doing things

1. People new to those ways have to adjust
2. It brings back old players, who spread the "attitude to new players"

and leads to the same community feeling that Maple had then. We lost that feeling because of the decisions Nexon made, not because the community evolved.

The thing is Nexon has no interest in doing it though. They're milking everything they can in preparation for Maple Story 2. It's easier to learn from your mistakes with new titles than try to salvage an old game, especially when that new title is already nearing completion and is really shiny.

I play beginner because it hasn't changed since pre-bb. Suckers for nostalgia like me should do the same, it's great!

I think the "Old MapleStory" events are very boring. Sure, they provide a nice nostalgia towards them but the drop rate and quests are extremely difficult if you're a high level. They really should implement "old" Orange Mushrooms instead of just the regular.

Take out pay-to-win, rich-vs-poor, and shortcuts. Once they do that, the community will be friendlier.

With NX not being the way a player can get far, players will have to rely on each other to do things.

With the market being player vs player instead of player vs system, mesos become a currency for each other rather than for the game, which it is made for. Admit it, everything in NPC shops are practically useless and dirt cheap that even considering them a meso sink is far from our minds. Whereas the free market is the focus of meso spending. "I need more mesos in order to buy that godly ___." This stimulates a strong competition between players and encourages the rich to get richer off the poor so that the poor can get poorer. It's a form of selfish advancement.

With the various methods of teleporting from map to map, players never get to explore the game's world unless they absolutely feel bored with the game. In an honest survey, one would learn that 0-1 out of an entire alliance would remember what "Windy Peak" is because the map never gets traffic. However, all out of all would know what SH is and that's just two letters. By having players explore the map and be rewarded for it beneficially, players would then bump into other players and stimulate a community.

Then there's the other side of the argument.

As a game ages, players learn the game's ins-and-outs. They learn how to get through the game's system as efficiently as possible, and will obviously abuse that method. It's only in a game's early stages are the players testing out the water and actually playing the game. It's because they're oblivious to what the game has to offer. They're still looking for that efficient method. It's a sort of instinct everything has: trial and error until you get the right one. Once it gets the right one, it'll abuse it out of its rewards.

tl;dr Maplestory is unfixable. The community grew this way over years and years. Changing that would take an entire system revamp, which is too huge of a gamble for Nexon to take as it'll most likely result in them falling behind in the MMORPG race. You could easily see that Maplestory is barely grasping for air on the surface while new games live comfortably beside it.

Community is one thing but since there is no profitable edge to reverting back its the most important factor in why they haven't even mentioned the idea of doing this.

The Pre-BB community was soo much fun and helpful.

A lot of people are missing pre-bb not only because of the nostalgic gameplay and what they did back then, but also because of how the community was back then and how everyone helped each other and how teamwork and party play was something people were actually looking for. Bringing back the old MS or even reverting back to it wont really change much because the community wont be the same as it was back then, the current and evolved MS community is separated into 3 categories nowadays.

1) Elitists who solo all the bosses and gets pissed when the market isn't in their favor.
2) Elitists who do the same as #1 except they giveaway 5 mill CRA gear to boost their ego and pride
3) And the small remaining fraction who actually have tight-knit guilds who help each other out

[quote=TheMagi]Plenty of...places with similar populations to GMS and far outmatches most servers(cept for Scania).

If there was an officially endorsed old school server(without pay2win) people would flock to it.

Like I don't think MapleStory players themselves realize how dead the game now is, at least on gMS.[/quote]
Again, I highly doubt that most of the community will flock back to GMS or that it will attract new/veteran players. MMORPGs really aren't doing well in this day and age across all games and this trend isn't going to stop even if Nexon releases an "old school server." There also isn't even a high demand for the Old Maple; rather, there's just a bunch of nostalgia that doesn't necessarily translate to the desire for an un-updated server.

People also sensationalize the pre-BB experience and I think what they are forgetting is that most of the experience came from a community and the community attitude. In our current state of the game, we still have access to bossing together, party quests, training but they have all taken different forms since the game has evolved. We lack the community number that MS had years ago and I think that's one of the biggest factors of why this game isn't as fun anymore. This is why I am most looking forward to seeing how the Maple Leaf Council member of Community Life will contribute to the team.

please bring back the Old Maple event plsplsplsplsplspls

Bringing back the old MS maps and other things won't necessarily bring back everything else that people liked back then.
e.g - More social interaction
- Better community?
- No pay to win aspect
- etc etc

I remember when KMS came out, bishops were like the best classes with genesis skills. Then I played one but I didn't know it took that long to lvl. But If I have to choose I'll chose the old maple very fun and peaceful ~

[quote=LiliKoby]A completely new server that was pre enhancement and potential would be really nice (those came out before big bang idk why everyones always like pre-bb when all bb did was a few new jobs, events, and a new UI)[/quote]

IIRC post-BB was horrid for awhile. Mob exp was completely effed so finding training maps was absolutely horrid. People were inside the chimney from 20-100 and galloperas till 140 because those were the only mobs that gave decent exp. This was even the time they took out 2x coupons for everyone. It wasn't until they added party play at LHC that all this nonsense got fixed.

A completely new server that was pre enhancement and potential would be really nice (those came out before big bang idk why everyones always like pre-bb when all bb did was a few new jobs, events, and a new UI)

[quote=iElmo]Maybe how Nexon did it with the Old Maple event but probably not permanently. Tbh, people think that they will like the old Maple better if it's brought back but I highly doubt they will.[/quote]

Plenty of...places with similar populations to GMS and far outmatches most servers(cept for Scania).

If there was an officially endorsed old school server(without pay2win) people would flock to it.

Like I don't think MapleStory players themselves realize how dead the game now is, at least on gMS.

Maybe how Nexon did it with the Old Maple event but probably not permanently. Tbh, people think that they will like the old Maple better if it's brought back but I highly doubt they will.

They already released an Old Maple event a while back. I think that was their response to players demanding nostalgia outlets. I doubt they would start a new separate server with the old engine - similar to how Runescape created Old RS - because Nexon is currently turning their focus towards MS2, not MS.

No.