General

nice stats @lolitstom: right now im at 16.4k luk, 33%atk, 257%boss, and 92%pdr. im only doing like 25-30mil lines with MC. Still got alot of work to do...

@d2girls: Tbh, I'm not 100% sure what my range is. I know that on non PDR bosses I am able to deal 58m midnight carnival hits. My stats are as follows : 18.4k Luk, 51% atk, 378% boss (lol) (you could argue I can trade for % atk but TBH the change is marginal for the cost input), 346 atk dagger, 10+ star tyrants (incl gloves.) and 97% max crit.

what range would you need to do this? above the visible 2-2m?

@d2girls: Yeah, once you start dealing 50m or more with each midnight carnival hit, it is technically better to use midnight carnival over assassinate. That being said, its bloody hard to do.

why do people use mc in calculating dps, isn't assassinate a better and harder hitting skill? is mc just better at higher ranges or something

@ziub: It was a misinterpreted statement by a large amount of the community. Once you could cap on MC, Meso explosion soon followed in capping. Considering meso explosion is almost 3 times as strong as MC, there would be a huge power spike moving from MC to ME. But in order to actually utilise ME, you need to build up coins, where you typically use MC to do so.

This being said, it is still possible to do this, but you require a 5 second cooldown reduction hat.

@deadlystabxx: Well yeah but that's done and gone why talk about that o.o just like how WH had the big nerf also. I was strictly talking about MC since I've been hearing that a capping Carnival is like the strongest thing ever.

@ziub: You do realize the main reason why shadowers were scary strong was because of meso explosion right? Not midnight carnival (as strong as it is). The total damage from 1 MC would be 1.29bil per attack while the total damage from 1 ME would be 3bil (+5 meso hyper). Now imagine the total damage a shadower would pull off if there wasn't a cooldown on that skill anymore.

Lost faith in shads when a WH did more than a shad capping with carnival...like seriously that's scary lol

Wild Hunter - 133.221b -imgur.com/gbguZO2
Shadower - 124.090b -imgur.com/a/KCJ3s

hmmmmmmm

i know ideal conditions dont occur, but it should give you an idea:

Capping Night Lord with max attack speed: http://i.imgur.com/q7ekN6O.png (57.28b)

Capping Shadower with max attack speed: http://i.imgur.com/lHz0sph.png (68.01b)

Shadower damage to match the DPM of a capping Night Lord:
Shadower hitting 84m as the minimum crit line on Assassinate: http://i.imgur.com/QkwEbj4.png (57.19b)
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At hell gollux, 1 Epic Adventure used at the start on both runs:
Night Lord (close to 100% cap, ~46m as the minimum crit line on Quad Throw): http://i.imgur.com/vLLrSuc.png
Shadower (~75m as the minimum crit line on Assassinate): http://i.imgur.com/gBlVuOv.png

Venom is about 3b extra with practical amount of stats . Still not enough to go past 60b . And as I said if you want to compare ideal to ideal it needs to exceed 65b ignoring venom effects

@masinko: you also left out venom

@lolitstom: lol, i messed up.
fixed the numbers now, but yeah, these ideal scenarios almost never occur in-game.

@masinko: are you sure that 35.961b + 9.23b is 51.346?? That looks more like a little over 46b and then 780/667.5 times this gives about 53b

There has been a screenshot floating around that nate with venom ought to reach around 69b I don't like to refer to it since it feels super ideal. 60b is what I have managed to pull in a combat situation

@lolitstom : Well, regular delay on QT is 780ms, last I checked. That means that they can have about ~76.9 hits per second. Capping on QT, means that they do 467.5m damage per QT, means 35961.5m damage in one minute. Mark of Ninja hits 4 times (assuming one target) at a 60% success rate, which means you can get 46.1 extra MoN strickes, on 4 capping strikes means around 9,230m damage in one minute. This total combined DPS from both is 45191.5m under pretty ideal conditions.

So if they get their skill delay below 587.5ms using boosters, MPE, DSI, IA, etc, then they can.

edit: i can't math.

Perhaps you're right. Though I haven't seen any definitive evidence that an NL can dish out more than 60b damage per minute (something that i can confirms doable with just nate)

I was originally a Shadower up until lv 210, and was capping with nate. Switched to NL, and was able to solo much much faster

Functionally speaking, I am not sure why you would want to out damage an NL with MC. Assassinate capping beats MC up to around 50m. So a capping assassinate shadower already deals more than a capping NL

@hattysoopro: ya bb 20k luk sounds right 2 me or at least somewhere in that area

20k is a good start for a funded shad... get a 3-5 cooldown hat for ME because its easier to cap than MC and its dps is better

so that being said, 20k sounds about right to you?

i know that 70m is when MC outdamages a DB
idk if i rmbr correctly but i think 40m is when MC outdamages a NL

o and u need ~36k luk to cap on mc/me