Post Big Bang Training Guide
[header]NEW FORMAT![/header]
[Header]Last Updated: April 4th[/header]
Welcome to my Post Big Bang Training guide!
Also check my new blog! http://maplebrick.wordpress.com/
As you know, in Korean MS, they have a new experience system. This new system makes it easiar to easy. Not a little bit, but A LOT. From expierience in KMS, I got from 1-44 in a day on 1x and to 70 in a week on 1x. Its great, but a lot of people level really fast.
[Header=TOC]Table of Contents[/header]
[s=/forum/1788426/#TOC]Table of Contents[/s]
[s=/forum/1788426/#ACC]Accuracy System[/s]
[s=/forum/1788426/#Training]Training Areas[/s]
[s=/forum/1788426/#Credits]Credits[/s]
[s=/forum/1788426/#FAQ]FAQ[/s]
[Header=ACC]What is the new accuracy system?[/header]
Along with the accuracy need to attack a guy, you'll miss too.
For every level that its higher then you, there is a 5% miss rate.
For example, if you're level 30, trying to hit a level 32 monster, you'll miss 10% because its two levels higher.
[Header=Training]Training Places[/header]
[i]Name, Level, HitPoints, Experience Each[/i]
[Header]1-10[/Header]
[b]-Job Quests[/b]
[b]-Beginner Quests[/b]
[Header]11-20[/Header]
[b]-Job Quests [/b]
[b]-Octopus[/b]
[i]Octopus, Level 12, HP 175, EXP 21, [/i]
[b]-Blue Pigs[/b] - Highly Recommended
[i]Blue Pigs, Level 13, HP 200, EXP 23 [/i]
[b]-Jr Wraiths[/b] - Alternative
[i]Jr Wraiths, Level 15, HP 250, EXP 26[/i]
[b]-Golems[/b] - Highly Recommended
[i]Stone Golem, Level 20, HP 375, EXP 35 [/i]
[i]Dark Stone Golem, Level 23, HP 465, EXP 40 [/i]
[i]Mixed Stone Golem, Level 26, HP 5xx, EXP 47 [/i]
[b]-Rotting Skeletons[/b]
[i]Level 20, HP 850, EXP 74 [/i]
[Header]21-30[/Header]
[b]-Blue Pigs[/b] - Recommended
[i]Blue Pigs, Level 13, HP 200, EXP 23[/i]
[b]-Rotting Skeletons[/b] - Recommended
[i]Level 20, HP 850, EXP 74[/i]
[b]-Golems[/b] - Highly Recommended
[i]Stone Golem, Level 20, HP 375, EXP 35 [/i]
[i]Dark Stone Golem, Level 23, HP 465, EXP 40 [/i]
[i]Mixed Stone Golem, Level 26, HP 5xx, EXP 47 [/i]
[B]-Zombie Lupins[/b] - Highly Recommended
[i]Zombie Lupin, Level 28, HP 5xx, EXP 5x [/i]
[Header]31-50[/Header]
[b]-CPQ[/b] - Highly Recommended
[b]-Mushroom Kingdom[/b] - Highly Recommended
[b]-Kerning Square Quests[/b] - Alternative
[b]-CDs[/b] - Highly Recommended
[i]Latest Hits Compilation, Level 41, HP 2000, EXP 99 [/i]
[i]Greatest Oldies, Level 45, HP 2400, EXP 112 [/i]
[b]-Truckers[/b]
[i]Trucker, Level 48, HP 2760, EXP 135[/i]
[b]-Scarecrows[/b] - Recommended
[i]Dead Scarecrow, Level 50,HP 3300, EXP 220[/i]
[Header]51-60[/Header]
[b]-Truckers[/b]
[i]Trucker, Level 48, HP 2760, EXP 135[/i]
[b]-Scarecrows[/b] - Recommended
[i]Dead Scarecrow, Level 50, HP 3300, EXP 220 [/i]
[b]-Trojans[/b] - Recommended
[i]Toy Trojan, Level 57, HP 4600, EXP 172[/i]
[b]-Drakes[/b] - Highly Recommended
[i]Copper Drake, Level 50, HP 3000,EXP 130[/i]
[i]Drake, Level 52, HP 3400, EXP 141[/i]
[b]-Teddies[/b] - Alternative
[i]Brown Teddy, Level 49, HP 2880, EXP 126[/i]
[i]Pink Teddy, Level 51, HP 3200, EXP 135, [/i]
[i]Panda Teddy, Level 54, HP 3800, EXP 151[/i]
[B]-Voodoo and Hoodoos[/b] - Recommended
[i]Voodoo, Level 60, HP 6800, 335[/i]
[i]Hoodoo, Level 60, HP 6800, 335[/i]
[b]-Robos[/b] - Highly Recommended
[i]Robo, Level 61, HP 5900, EXP 204[/i]
[i]Master Robo, Level 63, HP 6700, EXP 222[/i]
[Header]61-70[/Header]
[b]-Ghost Ship Party Quest[/b] - Highly Recommended (Alternative to PPQ)
[b]-Pirate Party Quest[/b] (Herb Town PQ) - Highly Recommended
[B]-Voodoo and Hoodoos[/b] - Recommended
[i]Voodoo, Level 60, HP 6800, 335[/i]
[i]Hoodoo, Level 60, HP 6800, 335[/i]
[b]-Robos[/b] - Recommended
[i]Robo, Level 61, HP 5900, EXP 204[/i]
[i]Master Robo, Level 63, HP 6700, EXP 222[/i]
[b]Puppets[/b] - Highly Recommended
[i]Puppeteers, Level 66, HP ?, EXP 354[/i]
[b]Zeta Greys[/b] - Highly Recommended
[i]Zeta Grey, Level 67, HP 8500, EXP 263[/i]
[b]-Desert Rabbits[/b]
[i]Desert Rabbit (F), Level 67, HP 8500, EXP 263[/i]
[i]Desert Rabbit (M) Level 68, HP 9000, EXP 274[/i]
[b]-Mateons and Plateons[/b] - Recommended
[i]Mateon, Level 66, HP 8000, EXP 252[/i]
[i]Plateon, Level 69, HP 9500, EXP 285[/i]
[b]-Sites[/b]
[i]Site, Level 68, HP 13000, EXP 265[/i]
[b]-Windraiders[/b]
[i]Windraider, Level 70, HP 10000, EXP 296[/i]
[b]-Jesters[/b] - Highly Recommended
[i]Twisted Jester, Level 70, HP 50000, EXP 1325[/i]
[Header]71-80[/Header]
[b]Zeta Greys[/b] - Recommended
[i]Zeta GreyLevel 67, HP 8500, EXP 263[/i]
[b]-Desert Rabbits[/b]
[i]Desert Rabbit (F), Level 67, HP 8500, EXP 263 (F)[/i]
[i]Desert Rabbit (M), Level 68, HP 9000, EXP 274 (M)[/i]
[b]-Mateons and Plateons[/b]
[i]Mateon, Level 66, HP 8000, EXP 252[/i]
[i]Plateon, Level 69, HP 9500, EXP 285[/i]
[b]-Jesters[/b] - Highly Recommended
[i]Twisted Jester, Level 70, HP 50000, EXP 1325 [/i]
[b]-Windraiders[/b]
[i]Windraider, Level 70, HP 10000, EXP 296 [/i]
[b]-Sand Rats[/b] - Highly Recommended
[i]Sand Rat, Level 77, HP 19000, EXP 487[/i]
[b]-Tippos[/b] - Highly Recommended
[i]Tippo Red, Level 80, HP 25000, EXP 694 [/i]
[i]Tippo Blue, Level 83, HP 31000, EXP 831 [/i]
[b]-Scorpions[/b] - Highly Recommended
[i]Scorpion, Level 81, HP 27000, EXP 650[/i]
[b]-Triple Rumos[/b]
[i]Triple Rumo, Level 82, HP 29000, EXP 689[/i]
[B]-Blooper Scarlions[/b]
[i]Blooper Scarlions, Level 82, HP 2900, EXP 786[/i]
[Header]81-90[/Header]
[b]-Hob Goblin PQ[/b] - Recommended
[b]-Jesters[/b] - Highly Recommended
[i]Twisted Jester, Level 70, HP 50000, EXP 1325[/i]
[b]-Sand Rats[/b] - Recommended
[i]Sand Rat, Level 77, HP 19000, EXP 487[/i]
[b]-Scorpions[/b] - Highly Recommended
[i]Scorpion, Level 81, HP 27000, EXP 650[/i]
[B]-Blooper Scarlions[/b]
[i]Blooper Scarlions, Level 82, HP 2900, EXP 786[/i]
[b]-Tippos[/b] - Recommended
[i]Tippo Red, Level 80, HP 25000, EXP 694 [/i]
[i]Tippo Blue, Level 83, HP 31000, EXP 831 [/i]
[b]-Muates[/b]
[i]Iron Mutate,Level 83, HP 31000, EXP 729[/i]
[i]Reinforced Iron Mutate, Level 84, HP 33000, EXP 767[/i]
[i]Mithril Mutate, Level 86, HP 37000, EXP 843[/i]
[i]Reinforced Mithril Mutate, Level 87, HP 39000, EXP 880[/i]
[b]-Vikerola[/b] - Recommended
[i]Vikerola, Level 87, HP 36000, EXP 1010[/i]
[b]-Roids[/b] - Highly Recommended
[i]Roid, Level 88, HP 41000, EXP 917[/i]
[i]Neo Huroid, Level 89, HP 43000, EXP 954[/i]
[B]-Gobies[/b]
[i]Exploding Goby House, Level 90, HP 40500, EXP 0[/i]
[i]Goby, Level 91, HP 47000, EXP 1026[/i]
[b]-MP3[/b] - Highly Recommended
[i]Selkie Jr, Level 90, HP 45000, EXP 1130 [/i]
[i]Slimy, Level 93, HP 51000, EXP 1260 [/i]
[Header]91-100[/Header]
[b]-Vikerola[/b]
[i]Vikerola, Level 87, HP 36000, EXP 1010[/i]
[b]-Roids[/b] - Recommended
[i]Roid, Level 88, HP 41000, EXP 917[/i]
[i]Neo Huroid, Level 89, HP 43000, EXP 954[/i]
[B]-Gobies[/b]
[i]Exploding Goby House, Level 90, HP 40500, EXP 0[/i]
[i]Goby, Level 91, HP 47000, EXP 1026[/i]
[b]-MP3[/b] - Highly Recommended
[i]Selkie Jr, Level 90, HP 45000, EXP 1130[/i]
[i]Slimy, Level 93, HP 51000, EXP 1260[/i]
[b]-Galloperas[/b] - Recommended
[i]Gallopera, Level 94, HP 43000, EXP 1300[/i]
[b]-Mr Anchors[/b]
[i]Mr. Anchor, Level 98, HP 61000, EXP 1450[/i]
[b]-Himes[/b]
[i]Dreamy Ghost, Level 100, HP 65000, EXP 1334[/i]
[b]-Typhon[/b] - Recommended
[i]Typhon, Level 100, HP 65000, EXP 1334[/i]
[Header]100-120[/Header]
[b]-Himes[/b]
[i]Dreamy Ghost, Level 100, HP 65000, EXP 1334[/i]
[b]-Typhon[/b]
[i]Typhon, Level 100, HP 65000, EXP 1334[/i]
[b]-Pirates[/b] - Highly Recommended
[i]Krus, Level 103, HP 71000, EXP 1431[/i]
[i]Captains, Level 105, HP 75000, EXP 1495[/i]
[b]-Sharks[/b]
[i]Shark, Level 105, HP 75000, EXP 1495[/i]
[i]Cold Shark, Level 107, HP 79000, EXP 1557[/i]
[B]-Harps[/b] - Recommended
[i]Harp, Level 109, HP 83000, EXP 1618[/i]
[i]Blood Harp, Level 112, HP 89000, EXP 1719[/i]
[B]-Ghost Pirates[/b] - Highly Recommended
[i]Ghost Pirate, Level 110, HP 85000, EXP 1649[/i]
[i]Dual Ghost Pirate, Level 114, HP 93000, EXP 1769[/i]
[b]-Kents[/b] - Recommended
[i]Red Kentauraus, Level 118, HP 101000, EXP 1884[/i]
[i]Black Kentauraus, Level 118, HP 101000, EXP 1884[/i]
[i]Blue Kentauraus, Level 118, HP 101000, EXP 1884[/i]
[b]-Vikings[/b] - Highly Recommended
[i]Spirit Viking, Level 119, HP 103000, EXP 1912[/i]
[Header]121-140[/Header]
[b]-Kents[/b]
[i]Red Kentauraus, Level 118, HP 101000, EXP 1884[/i]
[i]Black Kentauraus, Level 118, HP 101000, EXP 1884[/i]
[i]Blue Kentauraus, Level 118, HP 101000, EXP 1884[/i]
[b]-Vikings[/b] - Recommended
[i]Spirit Viking, Level 119, HP 103000, EXP 1912[/i]
[b]-Werewolves and Lycans[/b] - Highly Recommended
[i]Werewolf, Level 127, HP 120000, EXP 2149[/i]
[i]Lycanthrope,Level 129, HP 130000, EXP 2303[/i]
[b]-Zombies[/b] - Highly Recommended
[i]Coolie Zombie, Level 131, HP 145000, EXP 2529[/i]
[i]Miner Zombie, Level 131, HP 145000, EXP 2529[/i]
[B]-Cornions[/b] - Recommended
[i]Green Cornian, Level 136, HP 165000, EXP 2823[/i]
[i]Dark Cornian, Level 142, HP 195000, EXP 3250[/i]
[B]-Lion Heart Castle[/b] - Highly Recommended
[Header]141-160[/Header]
[B]-Cornions[/b] - Recommended
[i]Green Cornian, Level 136, HP 165000, EXP 2823[/i]
[i]Dark Cornian, Level 142, HP 195000, EXP 3250[/i]
[b]-Skelegons[/b]
[i]Level 147, HP 220000, EXP 3594[/i]
[i]Level 153, HP 260000, EXP 4146[/i]
[b]-Temple of Time[/b] - Highly Recommended
[i]Qualm Monk, Level 151, HP 240000, EXP 4633[/i]
[i]Qualm Monk Trainee, Level 153, HP 260000, EXP 4975[/i]
[i]Qualm Guardian, Level 155, HP 280000, EXP 5312[/i]
[i]Chief Qualm Guardian, Level 157, HP 280000, EXP 5646[/i]
[i]Oblivion Monk, Level 160, HP 330000, EXP 6139[/i]
[B]-Lion Heart Castle[/b] - Highly Recommended
[Header]161-180[/Header]
[b]-Skelegons[/b]
[i]Level 147, HP 220000, EXP 3594[/i]
[i]Level 153, HP 260000, EXP 4146[/i]
[b]-Temple of Time[/b] - Highly Recommended
[i]Oblivion Monk, Level 160, HP 330000, EXP 6139[/i]
[i]Oblivion Monk Trainee, Level 162, HP 350000, EXP 6463[/i]
[i]Oblivion Guardian, Level 164, HP 370000, EXP 6783[/i]
[i]Chief Oblivion Guardian, Level 166, HP 390000, EXP 7099[/i]
[B]-Lion Heart Castle[/b] - Highly Recommended
[Header]181-200[/Header]
[b]-Temple of Time[/b] - Highly Recommended
[i]Oblivion Guardian, Level 164, HP 370000, EXP 6783[/i]
[i]Chief Oblivion Guardian, Level 166, HP 390000, EXP 7099[/i]
[B]-Lion Heart Castle[/b] - Highly Recommended
[Header=Credits]Credits[/header]
I wrote this guide with the help of:
-Ellin Forest
-EF/Helios/Century Alliance(KMS)
-GMST, KMS, GMS
-[url=http://www.basilmarket.com/MapleStory-Guide-KMS-Big-Bang-Revamp-333.html]Kruimel0's AMAZING GUIDE[/url]
-[url=http://www.basilmarket.com/MapleStory-monsters.html]Basilmarket's Monster List[/url]
-[url=http://www.basilmarket.com/user/bleachedguy]Bleachedguy[/url]
-[url=http://www.basilmarket.com/user/HeirOfPirate]HeirOfPirate[/url]
-Mr Basil and Staff!
Good luck training!
[b]-Jitterbug118[/b]
174 Comments • Newest first
can someone explain what the #%$@ is this "Big Bang"? Lol
I quitted GMS for 3 years and just got back recently and I have totally no idea what is this Big Bang everyone is referring to o.o
Ok. Must say this is a very good guide and easy to read and follow.
I just want to know a good place for a level 80 ranger. Got any suggestions?
I've hav been told: roids or something. Is it any good?
Jesters or roids?
Thanks a lot.
Looks like I'm headed to NLC for (v)hoodoos
For the next 9-10lvls
nice guide thanks(:
[quote=DemonArmX]So, basically you chop off all the sections from 121-200 and replace them with LHC?[/quote]
Yea pretty much.
Can i show u the fact that greatest oldies arent lvl 45? theyre 42... No offence intended
GREAT guide! Alot of different spots!
[quote=swordsmen66]where can a cleric train from levels 61~80?[/quote]
Try Jesters, Voodoos, Hoodoos.
ive found malady's in ellinia to be amazing exp. similar to low level typhons. little movement, lots of killing and tons of exp. i highly reccomend anyone to give it a try.
malady is lvl 30, 60 exp per. not sure on hp, but easy enough to hit.
*Edit 1
Kargos are really good exp too as ive found. a little off the beaten path, but are 194 exp per. plus with how the map is set, its any class friendly.
Kargo is lvl 60, 194 exp per.
[quote=augownu]Well tbh i have seen this guide in 10 different sites so i want to no who is the person who actualy wrote thsi down[/quote]
This is My guide.
Properties of Jitterbug118. (Me)
Thanks. Sorry for delayed update. Will Add Lion Heart Castle Soon. ^_^
Can't wait~
y isn't this stickied?
Nice guide
Add in Klocks and dark klocks. I got 1%/ minute at level 102, better than Pirates. Maybe it's because they're fire weak, but good spawn nonetheless. If only that map was a bit smaller... BTW Why did you remove the map to train on?
Hey You should add in Dark Rashes/ Hobis and green hobis. IMO, theyre better than krus/ captains.
Is the Verne Mine at Edelstein good for 70+?
[quote=Fabler]What's a good coolie map? They seem pretty bad to me T.T[/quote]
Ehh Coolies are great, but their spawn is horrible. If not just try ToT.
A lot got nerfed.
Lemme fix a couple things.
Vikerolas are terrible. Worst spawn ever. Blooper Scarlions are decent though for low level 80s.
Sorry for delay, Updated~
Put Dark Rashes up for lvls 100-120. Also Hobis/ Green Hobis. Rlly good exp
octobunnies aren't good exp because there are lvl 88 monsters on that map so you would get hit all the time with massive damage
Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't Wraiths in Phantom Forest their old level 48 counterparts? Could be a nice alternative to Scarecrows and Truckers.
I would kill them passing through, and they give over 100 exp. There's no level shown, though.
[quote=junklet]-Octobunnies - Recommended
Octobunny, Level 73, HP 2200, EXP 530 - Mysterious Path 2
ARE TERRIBLE[/quote]
Used to be semi-decent until they balanced them. Now, yes, they are terrible.
Oh yeah, homonculus are decent at around 98ish.
what are "CDs"?
I'm really sorry if this has been asked, but is GSPQ or PPQ better for lv 60-70?
Octobunnies do not have the godly ratio of 2200/530 HP/EXP ratio now. They have 13k exp and give 407 exp. MP2 is a bad map to train on, especially with the level 88 Pac Pinkies on the same map.
[quote=yadayadayada]for 61-70 where are the puppets that give 504 exp? how do i get there?[/quote]
http://ellinforest.com/forum/showthread.php?t=8770&highlight=Puppets
Try to follow it. xD
i heard some people are training at yetis from 115-120 :o
[quote=Beaten]Should a level 54 Dawn Warrior train at Voodoos/Hoodoos, mobs of 4, 335 EXP, or Toy Trojans?.
Please answer ASAP!~
EDIT: I get a level in about 25 minutes~half hour.[/quote]
Depends on job, but V+H are great for DW.
Thanks for the help
I like it, I give it 2 thumbs up d(^.^)b
Thanks everyone.
@jkfun1324 I'll see if they're good.
@ChaosC57 Thanks ~ I don't think they are highest recommended, their spawn + map layout isn't that good
@Cuertas Like Heir said, I prefer PPQ > Ghost Ship
[quote=iamKELTRON]Where are puppeteers?[/quote]
Try to follow it...Part of it is in Korean...
http://ellinforest.com/forum/showthread.php?t=8770&highlight=Puppets
[quote=HeirOfPirate]Blue ribbon pigs map is: Beach Blue Ribbon Beach
Golem temple would be:Golem Temple: Golem's Temple Entrance
Mixed golem would be: Golem Temple: Golem Temple 4
Jesters would be: Chimney Processed by the Clown or Toy Room
Rotting skeletons would be: Chimney Processed by the Skeletons
Mushroom Castle would be : Mushroom Castle: Mushroom Forest Field
Cd's would be Kerring Square: 7th Floor 8th Floor Area A
Drakes would be: Drake Crave: Sunless Cave
Robos is Ludi:Toy Factory <Aparatus room>
Zeta's are Omega Sector: Kulan Field III
Trojans are Ludi: Sky Terrace <5>
EDIT Zombie Lupins are great,
Highly Recommended, Map is Cursed Forest: Dark Tree Forest[/quote]
Thanks ~
I forgot about Lupins... OMG. -.-
I know they are Level 28 and give ... 53 XP IIRC?
@Cuertas You can PQ for the first couple levels. Then go to jesters/puppets/H+v.
@Jarretboyle I'll add it. Thanks for the contribution!
@Fajsak Thanks for correction...That was before BB .... xD
I think you made a mistake for the MP3 mobs. xD I doubt they only have 5-7k HP.
[quote=HeirOfPirate]Wow this looks SOOO much better then the old one... good job *high five* ill help on maps.[/quote]
Ok Thanks.
Gonna add you to credits.
[quote=ExpiredMilk]Himes = Dreamy Ghosts - Mushroom shrine, way at the end where the boss Dark Crow spawns.
Gobies - Aqua Road (Check world map to specifiy)
Ginseng Jars - Two maps outside Herb Town (Check world map to specify)
Buffies - Ludi, in the lower clock tower, left side (Check world map to specify)[/quote]
Himes is go right from mushroom shrine until you hit crow map. Go to top portal and keep going right.
[quote=nitro2k03]Hey where are the following?:
-Himes
-Gobies
-Ginseng Jars
-Buffies[/quote]
Himes = Dreamy Ghosts - Mushroom shrine, way at the end where the boss Dark Crow spawns.
Gobies - Aqua Road (Check world map to specifiy)
Ginseng Jars - Two maps outside Herb Town (Check world map to specify)
Buffies - Ludi, in the lower clock tower, left side (Check world map to specify)
[quote=HeirOfPirate]Your guide would be EVEN more amazing if u organized it, like @destroyer416 said. And make recommendations so people will know which is the best. And make the monsters name bold, ty.
And make the lv/hp/exp/mob like: EX. [b]Truckers[/b] [i]Lv.48, Hp. 2800, Exp. 136, Mob 7.[/i][b]7/10[/b]
And showing where it is, like [b]Truckers[/b][i] Singapore Urban Area 2[/i]
And in total it will look like this.
[b]Truckers[/b] [i]Lv.48, Hp. 2800, Exp. 136, Mob 7.[/i] [i] Singapore Urban Area 2[/i] [b] 7/10[/b]You don't have to do this but if you do, a lot of people will appreciate it. [/quote]
Wow thanks for the format! I'll play around with it.. Been thinking of ideas. Lemme note pad this.
did the octobunnies get nerfed?
I think they did like 100 XP?
[quote=destroyer416]I dislike this because it doesn't recomend any training areas and isn't very organized.[/quote]
Thats okay with me. Its meant for you to pick what you want..Like mobs ? High XP?
And organization...I need charts? But I can't make charts in threads.
And Above, it is.
[quote=taskin911]not anymre there around 600 exp and around lvl 80 it got nerfed like hell[/quote]
What you talking about ?
Thanks for the info !
Are you serious Snails for lvl 200!
Jitterbug118, MP3 the monsters give out 1k exp and 1.2k exp somewhere around that.
[quote=buyandsell]maybe add what maps earn alot money? just a suggestion, great guide[/quote]
I'll add that to my suggestion list...But I need this to be stickied and it will be a lot more organized. -.-
maybe add what maps earn alot money? just a suggestion, great guide
[quote=ToManyBladez]jitter can u post a dual blade guide after big bang ?[/quote]
I won't post a guide...But I can tell you builds, etc.
Just PM me for what you want.
[quote=nitro2k01]wats Hob Goblin PQ? and were is it?[/quote]
Check the PQ on your portal. Its 80+
wats Hob Goblin PQ? and were is it?