General

@demodango: I agree now! I CAN MOVE AROUND WITH IT TOO!

@sinknight: Yeah, I'm pretty psyched about the changes too.
The thing that really pissed me off about the old Shinsoku is that it forces us to commit to around 0.8 seconds of standing still while doing roughly half the %/sec that DBs do. That's just intolerable. This new incarnation of the skill is much more aesthetically pleasing, and certainly more useful.

[quote=sinknight]@demodango: well im mediocre funded atm. I have only 180k range, how much you think it will go up with mastery? Also thank you so much for the analysis of the two skills. I really hope these changes come soon, I actually am hyped for new shinsoku![/quote]

Mastery only affects your bottom range. bottom range. If your top range is 180k right now, then you should be at about 108k bottom range, right?
After the revamp you should be at about 171k range. (Assuming those mastery #s you gave are correct)

@demodango: well im mediocre funded atm. I have only 180k range, how much you think it will go up with mastery? Also thank you so much for the analysis of the two skills. I really hope these changes come soon, I actually am hyped for new shinsoku!

@sinknight: I'm using Silver Bullet's page as a reference: [url=http://uni-wz.com/blog-entry-1890.html]linky, I suggest learning Japanese[/url] [b]All speed values are at normal (6) speed.[/b]
It's absolutely the go-to bossing skill now for anything that has only 1 hit box. A full Rai combo is 1050 ms and deals 3246% damage per second on average, while its single-target equivalent in Battoujutsu mode is 2720 per 540ms, or 5037% per second assuming you're not interrupted somehow. Note that you can't step forward onto a boss's hit box to proc the dodge buffs without first letting go of the attack button--the auto-crawl feature of Hayato's attacks in Battoujutsu mode will not move you onto a hit box, as is the case now for the old incarnation of Sanrenzan.

Shinsoku, meanwhile, deals 330% twice, ~5 times per second (again, I'll need to confirm the timing somehow, but by observation it seems to be so). That's 3300% damage per second; not incredibly high compared to the rest, but that jumps to 4950% when the hyper is used (and it's available at level 143). Shinsoku cannot be interrupted by movement or knockback, though power kb/stun/etc will obviously end it. You can move at 70% speed during the effect to stay on a boss's hitbox.

Chances are that raw damage values for the Battoujutsu version of Sanrenzan per minute are MUCH higher when using MPE green pot/etc, since that breaks the speed cap.
Ultra-funded Hayatos will opt for Shinsoku since it has many more lines per second and all 3 hypers increase the total damage of the skill.

[quote=demodango]@sinknight: Shinsoku has been buffed by all standards, especially when you add the +1 hit hyper (which has not changed at all). I believe it has a cast rate (after the initial windup of ~540ms) of 5 times per second (on par with Phantom), dealing 330% twice, or thrice with the hyper. That's 990 * 5 = 4950% damage per second. Definitely not bad.
I haven't seen actual numbers for any changes to crit rate yet...*checks Japanese sites* Yeah, I don't see it listed on any sites I know of at the moment.[/quote]

So from what I am getting:
-Shinsoku mirrors the phantoms card stabby thingy.
-Better damage?
-I should put +1 line for it

Would this make it the go-to bossing skill? I usually use rai

@sinknight: Shinsoku has been buffed by all standards, especially when you add the +1 hit hyper (which has not changed at all). I believe it has a cast rate (after the initial windup of ~540ms) of 5 times per second (on par with Phantom), dealing 330% twice, or thrice with the hyper. That's 990 * 5 = 4950% damage per second. Definitely not bad.
I haven't seen actual numbers for any changes to crit rate yet...*checks Japanese sites* Yeah, I don't see it listed on any sites I know of at the moment.

[quote=demodango]Unless I'm mistaken, the crit chance on Hitokiri and on Battoujutsu Stance (when in single-target mode) still add up to the same values as before. Where did you read that Hayato loses crit rate overall? They're still the easiest class to get 100% crit rate on and crit damage is still the highest of any class, especially with Decent SE.

With 60% mastery, our average basic attack damage was at 80% of our max range (before crit rate is factored in). Now it's 97.5% of our max range. That's an effective base damage increase of about 22% (rounded).

I should note that the new 4th job skill's debuff on mobs is a multiplicative increase of 20% overall damage as well.[/quote]

I heard on the on one of the hayato update threads about the crit decrease and the ghetto shinsosku which really feels like a nerf on the skill (when it really needed a buff). But, its good to hear its otherwise and the damage boost.... yes, my body is ready.

I hope these updates come soon

Unless I'm mistaken, the crit chance on Hitokiri and on Battoujutsu Stance (when in single-target mode) still add up to the same values as before. Where did you read that Hayato loses crit rate overall? They're still the easiest class to get 100% crit rate on and crit damage is still the highest of any class, especially with Decent SE.

With 60% mastery, our average basic attack damage was at 80% of our max range (before crit rate is factored in). Now it's 97.5% of our max range. That's an effective base damage increase of about 22% (rounded).

I should note that the new 4th job skill's debuff on mobs is a multiplicative increase of 20% overall damage as well.