General

[quote=Omegathorion]I explained my logic behind autoaiming as a design decision. If your counterargument is "If they tried to remove aiming on say Human Revolution on the PC, people would be laughing for weeks"... you're making this conversation a little bit difficult. I mean, I love talking about game design, but lines like "Aiming in Deus Ex isn't one of those unnecessary elements" without explaining why will end up moving this conversation away from game design and more towards subjective preference. At this point, I guess you can decide whether or not you want to keep talking about this.[/quote]

Well I suppose this conversation has gone long enough. I didn't even realize you wanted to stay on one specific topic, but then again it's late here and I can't really think very well at this point. Also, I feel like with any rpg with fps elements in it, being able to aim on your own in some way is one of the most basic elements of that, and taking away basic elements of a game seems counterproductive.

My counterargument is that Deus Ex is simply just not meant for mobile/tablets, and "embracing the iOS and all it's differences" is just holding back the potential that any sequels/prequels can actually be. But again, I suppose that is still opinionated. Anyways, I guess we'll see how this turns out to be once they release more gameplay footage. Nice talking with you by the way.

[quote=imtwocats]Again, the only reason they removed aiming in the first place was because this is a mobile/tablet game. If they tried to remove aiming on say Human Revolution on the PC, people would be laughing for weeks. Deus Ex games are simply not meant for being played in the way Eidos is trying to advertise, and so far from what we've seen, it's quite unlikely to think that the experience will somehow be enjoyable on those platforms.

Aiming in Deus Ex isn't one of those unnecessary elements though. We might as well just start taking out open world exploration and play the game in the style of Time Crisis or have arrows pointing to places where you can sneak past enemies. There's a difference between unnecessary elements and simple game mechanics. I can't really think of anything Deus Ex needs removed except those candy bars you need to eat each time to refill your energy, but that was put in so you couldn't abuse your special abilities as much and that was actually needed as well. It's all dependent on what people enjoy and what the game is trying to offer I suppose.

Telltale's Walking Dead was more of an interactive story or movie rather then an actual game. I loved it myself, but of course it wouldn't be a fitting style for a game like Deus Ex. The problem with iOS is that I simply don't consider mobile/tablet gaming to be feasible when new gen consoles and PC gaming can easily beat anything that they have to offer. That and I don't own a smartphone or tablet to play any of these games on. I feel like Eidos and Square Enix are just trying too hard to jump on the bandwagon, when they've got plenty of fans waiting around for them to release some DLC for Human Revolution or a brand new Deus Ex game or a remake of FFVII or whatever else people have been waiting for. Yet instead they are appealing to a crowd which they have little to no support for and overall are alienating fans like myself who either dislike mobile/tablet gaming or don't own either of them. If they can't understand that people don't want a Deus Ex for the mobile/tablet, then they'll just have to learn from their mistakes.[/quote]
I explained my logic behind autoaiming as a design decision. If your counterargument is "If they tried to remove aiming on say Human Revolution on the PC, people would be laughing for weeks"... you're making this conversation a little bit difficult. I mean, I love talking about game design, but lines like "Aiming in Deus Ex isn't one of those unnecessary elements" without explaining why will end up moving this conversation away from game design and more towards subjective preference. At this point, I guess you can decide whether or not you want to keep talking about this.

[quote=Omegathorion]Deus Ex never took out the option to shoot your way through a room. You're still able to do that. It's just that the act of aiming has been boiled down. The act of aiming was only one small part of the whole "shoot your way through a room" element. Shooting your way through a room involves positioning, timing, awareness of surroundings, all that stuff (which is apparently maintained in The Fall). The shooting in Deus Ex was a small piece meant to supplement that element: it wasn't an element in and of itself. Now, shooting would very much be an element in and of itself in a dedicated FPS game like Halo. That's why Deus Ex is such a radically different experience than Halo. But the option of choosing combat over any other path still exists in The Fall. If they had completely taken combat in any way, shape, or form out of Deus Ex, then that would indeed be a problem.

If you remove an element from a game? Remove digging from Link's Awakening, remove platforming in Metal Gear Rising. Remove shooting in Mirror's Edge. Remove puzzles in God of War. Remove the hacking puzzles in Bioshock. Suddenly you get better games that don't force players to jump through unnecessary hoops. Aiming in Deus Ex in an unnecessary hoop that the player jumps through in order to reach the goal of "accomplish my mission through brute force." Try thinking about games you love, and what would happen if you slowly pulled elements out of them, like you're playing mental Jenga. Often, with really great games, every element is necessary. Portal without gels? Portal without faith plates? Portal without turrets? Each of those elements is there because it enhances the gameplay experience that much: there is nothing extraneous that gets in the way of the game's core experience, which is solving puzzles in order to escape from a crazy robot before she kills you with deadly neurotoxin.

The tablet thing is only a small roadblock, not some drastic measure that prevented them. If they really wanted to, they could have made some kind of shooting mini game, or they could have done shooting like in Telltale's The Walking Dead. There have been many great and innovative uses of the iOS platform for gaming, like Ziggurat and Infinity Blade. But going back to the metaphor, all of those things are just hoops to jump through. In Ziggurat and Infinity Blade, the act of shooting (or slashing) is fun in and of itself, but if you had to play a little shooting mini game every time you wanted to take someone out in Deus Ex, it would be horrible. Now, I'm not actually working on The Fall, so I don't really know how valid this next point I'm going to say is. But autolocking was a design decision, because if they wanted to, they could have implemented shooting in some way, shape, or form. In fact, I feel like they're trying too hard to retain the Human Revolution original feel, rather than embracing the iOS and all the differences it brings to game designers. Like how some iOS games use a virtual d-pad to control movement instead of having characters move to a position the player touches, or whatever would fit the game better.[/quote]

Again, the only reason they removed aiming in the first place was because this is a mobile/tablet game. If they tried to remove aiming on say Human Revolution on the PC, people would be laughing for weeks. Deus Ex games are simply not meant for being played in the way Eidos is trying to advertise, and so far from what we've seen, it's quite unlikely to think that the experience will somehow be enjoyable on those platforms.

Aiming in Deus Ex isn't one of those unnecessary elements though. We might as well just start taking out open world exploration and play the game in the style of Time Crisis or have arrows pointing to places where you can sneak past enemies. There's a difference between unnecessary elements and simple game mechanics. I can't really think of anything Deus Ex needs removed except those candy bars you need to eat each time to refill your energy, but that was put in so you couldn't abuse your special abilities as much and that was actually needed as well. It's all dependent on what people enjoy and what the game is trying to offer I suppose.

Telltale's Walking Dead was more of an interactive story or movie rather then an actual game. I loved it myself, but of course it wouldn't be a fitting style for a game like Deus Ex. The problem with iOS is that I simply don't consider mobile/tablet gaming to be feasible when new gen consoles, PC gaming, and handheld gaming can easily beat anything that they have to offer. That and I don't own a smartphone or tablet to play any of these games on. I feel like Eidos and Square Enix are just trying too hard to jump on the bandwagon, when they've got plenty of fans waiting around for them to release some DLC for Human Revolution or a brand new Deus Ex game or a remake of FFVII or whatever else people have been waiting for. Yet instead they are appealing to a crowd which they have little to no support for and overall are alienating fans like myself who either dislike mobile/tablet gaming or don't own either of them. If they can't understand that people don't want a Deus Ex for the mobile/tablet, then they'll just have to learn from their mistakes.

[quote=imtwocats]Deus Ex has been such a good game because the game doesn't tell you how to play. The puzzle solving can be anywhere from stealth to just shooting your way through. But whatever you choose, there isn't any linear path you have to take to get to your objective, which is why I enjoyed playing it so much. I agree that the majority of the core game comes down to the decision making. Even some of the "boss fights" where you can talk down an enemy into giving you a special code or be given access into a room you previously weren't allowed in were purely based on how good your decision making was. But again, Deus Ex doesn't tell you that you have to do that. The FPS shooter elements are part of that decision making as well, so taking that away would actually be taking away a bulk of the game, even it is just a small part. The game gives you all the tools you'd want to decide how you want to play the game, and all those tools and decisions combine together to make up the entirety of the game itself, and just taking out one of those parts like the FPS or stealth mechanics will be completely detrimental to the experience of some players.

I can understand that Weichi doesn't need any extra elements added onto it to make it a fun game, however what would happen if you removed an element from the game instead? I haven't played Weichi in years so I can't give an example, but wouldn't that be taking away from the experience of the game as well? I can see how adding unnecessary elements can make a game less enjoyable, and I can see the point you're trying to make, but my own point was that some games have key elements that shouldn't be taken away and should stay in order to make a game have it's full potential, such as Deus Ex should stay exclusive to PCs and consoles and not on mobile/tablets.

Well there are a lot of things that can be unnecessary to add into a game, such as the digging game in Link's Awakening or the platforming in Metal Gear Rising, and I really dislike them myself. I didn't mind the fps as much in Mirror's Edge as others did, (I thought it was nice that you didn't have to just run away from your enemies all the time) but yes I can see how that frustrated a lot of people considering it felt like they just added it in at the last second. But anyways, back to Deus Ex. The autolocking is only there because it's being played on mobiles/tablets. I have no idea how anyone could play an fps game or 3rd person shooter on one of those, so autolocking is basically necessary at that point. Though I feel like the mobiles/tablets themselves are the actual unnecessary element that should be taken out, at least in my opinion. Without the limitations that mobile and tablet gaming have, they would be able to develop a much better game that has both plenty of depth and complexity to it.[/quote]
Deus Ex never took out the option to shoot your way through a room. You're still able to do that. It's just that the act of aiming has been boiled down. The act of aiming was only one small part of the whole "shoot your way through a room" element. Shooting your way through a room involves positioning, timing, awareness of surroundings, all that stuff (which is apparently maintained in The Fall). The shooting in Deus Ex was a small piece meant to supplement that element: it wasn't an element in and of itself. Now, shooting would very much be an element in and of itself in a dedicated FPS game like Halo. That's why Deus Ex is such a radically different experience than Halo. But the option of choosing combat over any other path still exists in The Fall. If they had completely taken combat in any way, shape, or form out of Deus Ex, then that would indeed be a problem.

If you remove an element from a game? Remove digging from Link's Awakening, remove platforming in Metal Gear Rising. Remove shooting in Mirror's Edge. Remove puzzles in God of War. Remove the hacking puzzles in Bioshock. Suddenly you get better games that don't force players to jump through unnecessary hoops. Aiming in Deus Ex in an unnecessary hoop that the player jumps through in order to reach the goal of "accomplish my mission through brute force." Try thinking about games you love, and what would happen if you slowly pulled elements out of them, like you're playing mental Jenga. Often, with really great games, every element is necessary. Portal without gels? Portal without faith plates? Portal without turrets? Each of those elements is there because it enhances the gameplay experience that much: there is nothing extraneous that gets in the way of the game's core experience, which is solving puzzles in order to escape from a crazy robot before she kills you with deadly neurotoxin.

The tablet thing is only a small roadblock, not some drastic measure that prevented them. If they really wanted to, they could have made some kind of shooting mini game, or they could have done shooting like in Telltale's The Walking Dead. There have been many great and innovative uses of the iOS platform for gaming, like Ziggurat and Infinity Blade. But going back to the metaphor, all of those things are just hoops to jump through. In Ziggurat and Infinity Blade, the act of shooting (or slashing) is fun in and of itself, but if you had to play a little shooting mini game every time you wanted to take someone out in Deus Ex, it would be horrible. Now, I'm not actually working on The Fall, so I don't really know how valid this next point I'm going to say is. But autolocking was a design decision, because if they wanted to, they could have implemented shooting in some way, shape, or form. In fact, I feel like they're trying too hard to retain the Human Revolution original feel, rather than embracing the iOS and all the differences it brings to game designers. Like how some iOS games use a virtual d-pad to control movement instead of having characters move to a position the player touches, or whatever would fit the game better.

[quote=Omegathorion]The scale of simplicity/complexity is related to the scale of shallowness/depth, and "depth" is the core gameplay experience. I haven't played Dark Souls, so I will go back and talk about Deus Ex for this example. In Deus Ex, the core gameplay experience is all about puzzle solving, finding multiple solutions to a given scenario and making judgments on which of those solutions is most easily executed, is least likely to be detected, etc. A complex way to attain that level of depth would be to force the player to aim their weapons FPS style, whereas a simple way would be to have a lock-on system. Having FPS gameplay would add the element of accuracy and the question of "should I run the risk of missing this shot or not," but Deus Ex's core gameplay is not about mechanical skill: it is puzzle solving. The question of "should I run the risk of missing this shot or not" adds an unnecessary element to the more important question of "is it a good idea to make this shot," weighed out by the pro of killing a target and the con of alerting other guards, using ammo, etc. There are enough pros and cons that accuracy does not need to factor into the equation, as opposed to a game like Halo where decision making is not such an important gameplay element. You say that it is bad to "skip all of the bulk that make up the game," but the point is that there is a lot of bulk that doesn't make up the game, and that should be rightfully culled. FPS shooting doesn't make up Deus Ex, decision making makes up Deus Ex. There are enough elements that factor into decision making that FPS shooting would be extraneous and unnecessary.

I brought up weichi as an example of a game with depth that uses simple mechanics, not as an example of a game that is non-casual. The question of casual-ness in Deus Ex should be put aside considering the limited preview. My point is not that simplicity doesn't mean casual: my point is that simplicity doesn't mean shallow. Weichi was meant to illustrate the point that a game does not need to be complex to be deep. Weichi could be made unnecessarily complex: imagine if you could "reinforce" your pieces so that the opponent needs to surround them twice to capture them. See how adding an unnecessarily complex element just drags down the core gameplay experience? (If not, I'll try to elaborate.)

Unnecessarily complex element can drag down a core gameplay experience. Imagine if in Portal, your gunshots are pulled down by gravity (making precision aiming difficult in a game where precision aiming is necessary to solve puzzles, where the puzzles are what's actually fun). Or if in Braid, dying made you restart the level (making it an action platformer instead of an art puzzle). Or if in Maplestory, you had to type out your skill names to activate them, instead of just pressing a hotkey (making it a typing trainer instead of a MMORPG). Or if in Mirror's Edge you had to use aim with guns and be accurate (making it a FPS instead of a FP-parkour). No one liked the FPS shooting in Mirror's Edge, because it was an unnecessarily complex element that dragged down the core gameplay experience of being cool and running on walls. If Mirror's Edge had the player automatically lock on to targets when firing with a gun, you might say that it's dumbing down the game to make it easier. In reality, it's siphoning out the unnecessary elements in order to bring out the core gameplay experience. Same thing is happening with the autolocking in Deus Ex, but for a different reason.

I'm gonna drop the thing about respect because that's a philosophical debate. Shouldn't have bothered bringing it up.[/quote]

Deus Ex has been such a good game because the game doesn't tell you how to play. The puzzle solving can be anywhere from stealth to just shooting your way through. But whatever you choose, there isn't any linear path you have to take to get to your objective, which is why I enjoyed playing it so much. I agree that the majority of the core game comes down to the decision making. Even some of the "boss fights" where you can talk down an enemy into giving you a special code or be given access into a room you previously weren't allowed in were purely based on how good your decision making was. But again, Deus Ex doesn't tell you that you have to do that. The FPS shooter elements are part of that decision making as well, so taking that away would actually be taking away a bulk of the game, even it is just a small part. The game gives you all the tools you'd want to decide how you want to play the game, and all those tools and decisions combine together to make up the entirety of the game itself, and just taking out one of those parts like the FPS or stealth mechanics will be completely detrimental to the experience of some players.

I can understand that Weichi doesn't need any extra elements added onto it to make it a fun game, however what would happen if you removed an element from the game instead? I haven't played Weichi in years so I can't give an example, but wouldn't that be taking away from the experience of the game as well? I can see how adding unnecessary elements can make a game less enjoyable, and I can see the point you're trying to make, but my own point was that some games have key elements that shouldn't be taken away and should stay in order to make a game have it's full potential, such as Deus Ex should stay exclusive to PCs and consoles and not on mobile/tablets.

Well there are a lot of things that can be unnecessary to add into a game, such as the digging game in Link's Awakening or the platforming in Metal Gear Rising, and I really dislike them myself. I didn't mind the fps as much in Mirror's Edge as others did, (I thought it was nice that you didn't have to just run away from your enemies all the time) but yes I can see how that frustrated a lot of people considering it felt like they just added it in at the last second. But anyways, back to Deus Ex. The autolocking is only there because it's being played on mobiles/tablets. I have no idea how anyone could play an fps game or 3rd person shooter on one of those, so autolocking is basically necessary at that point. Though I feel like the mobiles/tablets themselves are the actual unnecessary element that should be taken out, at least in my opinion. Without the limitations that mobile and tablet gaming have, they would be able to develop a much better game that has both plenty of depth and complexity to it.

[quote=imtwocats]Simplicity is laziness in what Eidos is trying to do to this new Deus Ex game. Simplicity isn't the goal of game design anyways. Why would you take away core elements of a game just so the player can skip all of the bulk that make up the game in the first place? The goal is to create a fun and unique experience for the people to play it, not to make it easy enough for everyone to just move along with the adventure and disregard any difficulty. Granted, the definition of fun is different for everyone, but for most I'm sure simplicity isn't on the top of the list for people when they're determining what is fun or not. As for the video, I find it's sort of informative but I disagree with having to "dumb down" a game just so more people can understand the depth of it. Games like Dark Souls have great depth behind them while still having plenty of complexity, and if people can't get passed the complexity then that game simply isn't for them I suppose. Anyways, I'm getting off topic here. What Edios is trying to do to Deus Ex isn't simplifying the game to enable gamers to get the full experience of the game without frustration, but they're simplifying it so they can sell out and jump on the bandwagon that will ultimately end up falling off a cliff and into a ravine.

Games like Starcraft and go/weishi are considered non-casual because of the skill level required to play them effectively. They're geared towards high level players who have the thought process to be able to comprehend the tactics and strategy behind each game. I understand that simplicity doesn't mean casual, but many games that are geared towards casuals are some of the most simplistic games out there that have neither difficulty or depth.

Respect doesn't mean keeping something the same forever. The changes between the first Deus Ex and Human Revolution are huge, but in the newer game they still respect the core elements of the first game while introducing new aspects which continue to build the core. But anyways, this can easily change from game to game and is basically situational, so I won't go much further on this. But the reason I feel that the new Deus Ex game is disrespecting the series is because nobody wants a Deus Ex game that is mobile/tablet exclusive.[/quote]

The scale of simplicity/complexity is related to the scale of shallowness/depth, and "depth" is the core gameplay experience. I haven't played Dark Souls, so I will go back and talk about Deus Ex for this example. In Deus Ex, the core gameplay experience is all about puzzle solving, finding multiple solutions to a given scenario and making judgments on which of those solutions is most easily executed, is least likely to be detected, etc. A complex way to attain that level of depth would be to force the player to aim their weapons FPS style, whereas a simple way would be to have a lock-on system. Having FPS gameplay would add the element of accuracy and the question of "should I run the risk of missing this shot or not," but Deus Ex's core gameplay is not about mechanical skill: it is puzzle solving. The question of "should I run the risk of missing this shot or not" adds an unnecessary element to the more important question of "is it a good idea to make this shot," weighed out by the pro of killing a target and the con of alerting other guards, using ammo, etc. There are enough pros and cons that accuracy does not need to factor into the equation, as opposed to a game like Halo where decision making is not such an important gameplay element. You say that it is bad to "skip all of the bulk that make up the game," but the point is that there is a lot of bulk that doesn't make up the game, and that should be rightfully culled. FPS shooting doesn't make up Deus Ex, decision making makes up Deus Ex. There are enough elements that factor into decision making that FPS shooting would be extraneous and unnecessary.

I brought up weichi as an example of a game with depth that uses simple mechanics, not as an example of a game that is non-casual. The question of casual-ness in Deus Ex should be put aside considering the limited preview. My point is not that simplicity doesn't mean casual: my point is that simplicity doesn't mean shallow. Weichi was meant to illustrate the point that a game does not need to be complex to be deep. Weichi could be made unnecessarily complex: imagine if you could "reinforce" your pieces so that the opponent needs to surround them twice to capture them. See how adding an unnecessarily complex element just drags down the core gameplay experience? (If not, I'll try to elaborate.)

Unnecessarily complex element can drag down a core gameplay experience. Imagine if in Portal, your gunshots are pulled down by gravity (making precision aiming difficult in a game where precision aiming is necessary to solve puzzles, where the puzzles are what's actually fun). Or if in Braid, dying made you restart the level (making it an action platformer instead of an art puzzle). Or if in Maplestory, you had to type out your skill names to activate them, instead of just pressing a hotkey (making it a typing trainer instead of a MMORPG). Or if in Mirror's Edge you had to use aim with guns and be accurate (making it a FPS instead of a FP-parkour). No one liked the FPS shooting in Mirror's Edge, because it was an unnecessarily complex element that dragged down the core gameplay experience of being cool and running on walls. If Mirror's Edge had the player automatically lock on to targets when firing with a gun, you might say that it's dumbing down the game to make it easier. In reality, it's siphoning out the unnecessary elements in order to bring out the core gameplay experience. Same thing is happening with the autolocking in Deus Ex, but for a different reason.

I'm gonna drop the thing about respect because that's a philosophical debate. Shouldn't have bothered bringing it up.

[quote=Omegathorion]Simplicity as laziness: Simplicity is actually the goal of game design. If you're talking about pretentious indie art games, then the simplicity = laziness argument has some merit, but this isn't one of those games. The scale goes kind of like this: at low-level game design, you make simple games out of lack of skill (or laziness). At mid-level game design, you make overly complex games out of your desire to show off your awesomeness as a designer. At high-level game design (where Deus Ex and most triple-A games are), you simplify games to deliver the core essence of the experience to the player with as little in-between translation as possible. Check out the Extra Credits episode on [url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jVL4st0blGU]Depth vs. Complexity.[/url]

Simplicity as casual: Again, I'd refer to the Extra Credits episode and their example of go/weichi. Simplicity is not about being casual, it is about being focused on the core experience.

"A series which deserves more respect": Should something be decided by how it was in the past? Would it be considered a betrayal of her heritage for a black woman from the slums to study hard and become a successful lawyer? (I just read NW by Zadie Smith, with a pertinent essay [url=http://www.thenation.com/article/171387/im-nobody-who-are-you-zadie-smiths-nw]here.[/url]) This question leans more towards the philosophical rather than being actual game design, and either point could be argued so I'll just leave it at that.[/quote]

Simplicity is laziness in what Eidos is trying to do to this new Deus Ex game. Simplicity isn't the goal of game design anyways. Why would you take away core elements of a game just so the player can skip all of the bulk that make up the game in the first place? The goal is to create a fun and unique experience for the people to play it, not to make it easy enough for everyone to just move along with the adventure and disregard any difficulty. Granted, the definition of fun is different for everyone, but for most I'm sure simplicity isn't on the top of the list for people when they're determining what is fun or not. As for the video, I find it's sort of informative but I disagree with having to "dumb down" a game just so more people can understand the depth of it. Games like Dark Souls have great depth behind them while still having plenty of complexity, and if people can't get passed the complexity then that game simply isn't for them I suppose. Anyways, I'm getting off topic here. What Edios is trying to do to Deus Ex isn't simplifying the game to enable gamers to get the full experience of the game without frustration, but they're simplifying it so they can sell out and jump on the bandwagon that will ultimately end up falling off a cliff and into a ravine.

Games like Starcraft and go/weishi are considered non-casual because of the skill level required to play them effectively. They're geared towards high level players who have the thought process to be able to comprehend the tactics and strategy behind each game. I understand that simplicity doesn't mean casual, but many games that are geared towards casuals are some of the most simplistic games out there that have neither difficulty or depth.

Respect doesn't mean keeping something the same forever. The changes between the first Deus Ex and Human Revolution are huge, but in the newer game they still respect the core elements of the first game while introducing new aspects which continue to build the core. But anyways, this can easily change from game to game and is basically situational, so I won't go much further on this. But the reason I feel that the new Deus Ex game is disrespecting the series is because nobody wants a Deus Ex game that is mobile/tablet exclusive.

[quote=imtwocats]Making a game simplistic as possible is just an excuse for laziness. All they're doing is trying to make a quick profit off of a series which deserves more respect. Also if you've played Deus Ex games before, you can easily understand why the series isn't meant to be geared towards casuals.[/quote]
Simplicity as laziness: Simplicity is actually the goal of game design. If you're talking about pretentious indie art games, then the simplicity = laziness argument has some merit, but this isn't one of those games. The scale goes kind of like this: at low-level game design, you make simple games out of lack of skill (or laziness). At mid-level game design, you make overly complex games out of your desire to show off your awesomeness as a designer. At high-level game design (where Deus Ex and most triple-A games are), you simplify games to deliver the core essence of the experience to the player with as little in-between translation as possible. Check out the Extra Credits episode on [url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jVL4st0blGU]Depth vs. Complexity.[/url]

Simplicity as casual: Again, I'd refer to the Extra Credits episode and their example of go/weichi. Simplicity is not about being casual, it is about being focused on the core experience.

"A series which deserves more respect": Should something be decided by how it was in the past? Would it be considered a betrayal of her heritage for a black woman from the slums to study hard and become a successful lawyer? (I just read NW by Zadie Smith, with a pertinent essay [url=http://www.thenation.com/article/171387/im-nobody-who-are-you-zadie-smiths-nw]here.[/url]) This question leans more towards the philosophical rather than being actual game design, and either point could be argued so I'll just leave it at that.

"It was really important to us to make the game as simple as simple to play as possible"...just imagine the amount of simplifying it will take to make a game like Deus Ex mobile. Doubt any core gamers will have any interest in a highly dumbed down version of a great franchise.

[quote=Omegathorion]So... what's wrong with making a game simple to play?[/quote]

Making a game simplistic as possible is just an excuse for laziness. All they're doing is trying to make a quick profit off of a series which deserves more respect. Also if you've played Deus Ex games before, you can easily understand why the series isn't meant to be geared towards casuals.

I loved Deus Ex Human Revolution. This looks like the same exact game but new character, new storyline... Im not too mad at that really. I obviously like things taking a step forward, but I had a blast playing Human Revolution maybe three times total. A new game, but similar experience might be fun.

So... what's wrong with making a game simple to play?

There is a error in your title, it should be [i]"Deus ex : The Fail."[/i]

[quote=SodiumOH]I will wait for a PC port, then wait for it to go on sale.

If it doesn't come to PC, then I guess I'll never play it.[/quote]

I think this one will be mobile and tablet exclusive unless they somehow come to their senses. But sadly it's doubtful at the moment.

I will wait for a PC port, then wait for it to go on sale.

If it doesn't come to PC, then I guess I'll never play it.

I. Thought his was about mirai Nikki

the game sucked for xbox and it wont change for mobile...

And yet they will bank on it.