General

I agree because Nexon assumes that everybody has really good stuff so they make all the bosses hard to beat and then to get good stuff you have to beat those bosses and then they make new equips that you can't equip and only the really good people can.

[quote=Plenair]Hacks and exploits have always and will always be a part of this game, sure they change and have gotten worse over time, but that is killing the game in another way. Hacks and exploits kill the game, but here it's about how the game kills itself.[/quote]
Yes hacks and exploits will always be a part of the game, that is true. However, the actions nexon took to stop them were terrible. It has even come to the point where they are unbanning these hackers to try and retain some paying customers. Which makes it seem like nexon is killing maplestory themselves as well.

i have to say potential system is what ruined maple.
Before the potential system, the godly people only did at most, twice the damage as non funded people, but now, the godly funded people literally do 100 times more damage then unfunded people. This makes bossing either too hard or too difficult since nexon cant make both the funded and unfunded happy.

What I thought was fun about the old maplestory was the CHALLENGE. Levelling took a long time and getting to higher levels to get new skills and job advancements was rewarding because of this. High level monsters could 2 hit kill ranged characters, which was cool because it forced me to focus on keeping my HP up at all times. Bosses actually required 1 or 2 parties to take down, forcing players to get together and team up to get things done. Skill specific mastery books, equips, scrolls and other valuables used to drop from monsters at very low rates, and I personally enjoyed taking my time to hunt those monsters for such things.

Nowadays Maplestory today for me just feels like some kind of watered down pansy version of it's old self. Maplers are pretty much spoonfed throughout this game, as levelling has never been easier and those challenges of the past no longer exist. The only challenge left in this game is to spend your days merching so you can raise enough money to be insanely strong, or otherwise find a way to get your hands on thousands of $$ to fund your character so that you can solo all the bosses.

Patches updates and content were poorly thought out by developers
/thread

It's a myriad of things, but I do agree that potential is one of the bigger reasons.

@jonahthepwna: Yes it deals dmg based on a percentage of your hp not a set amount if a warrior has 30k he will get hit with 20k, if a sair has 3k he will get hit with 2k , ect

I'm surprised no one has mentioned hackers and their exploits yet. These 'second chance' events are definitely not helping. All these hackers came back with their exploited mesos and duped items.

So, question.
Should I bust the PS4 back out and just spend time getting platinum trophies on BF4 and ghosts (Getting Destiny and FF15 when they come out too), or just play this game and hope for the best?

[quote=Plenair]Interesting, now that I think about it the Chaos patch for Archers is quite the one that set the precedent for copy pasting classes, which got reinforced by Jump with their double jump. While they did do good for the class, can't really be said they did good for the game. Though it may of started back in Big Bang, with Shadowers getting FJ and SP, though none of us will complain about it, it is the first case of a class getting another class' skill. So back to BB killed Maple, lel.

Unleashed's Cap raise only occurred because of potentials mind you, damage cap raises would not of been this required if Nexon didn't add potentials, or potentials to this extreme. So the original problem for ruining the game I say is still the potential system, which doesn't need to be removed but definitely fixed and limited.[/quote]

I completely forgot Archers got a double jump in Chaos Patch, and I mained a Marksman then too.
Either way, that only reinforced my argument on class diversity.

Also, I think potential is fine, but yeah, it's out of hand to the state it is right now. Big bang had potential, but it wasn't really that crazy. It wasn't until bonus potential, superior items and nebulites where things started getting out of hand.

EDIT:

@AznFlip: You're not wrong, and I'm not disagreeing with you, but what I'm saying is the uniqueness of classes. Like every class had something unique to them (ie: archers and their crit, dark knights and their HP, etc). Now those stats are passed for every class, and if you need more, there are lots of things you can do (ie: links, character cards, etc) to get them.

[quote=Masinko]I disagree, I think the potential system was fine. But I think the two biggest downfall for MapleStory was Chaos and Unleashed. [Incoming wall-of-text, tl;dr in the bottom].

The Chaos Patch itself wasn't terrible, but the buffs they gave to archers started a precedent that, in my opinion, began to ruin MapleStory. Before, every class had pros and cons. For example, ranged classes (nightlord, gunslingers, archers, etc) could deal damage, but they had to keep their distance or risk being one-shotted since they were squishy. For this reason, you would have a party, so that each class could help one another out. But the Chaos Patch gave Archers Spirit Link, one of the components to it was +40% HP. This began the precedent that all classes had to fit this "Jack-of-All-Traits" concept. Pretty much, every class has skills that give them extra HP, crit, double-jumps, etc that used to be exclusive to only one job. This sort of began to kill the diversity of playstyle in classes.

Next unleashed, probably the worst patch out there. I came back to the game on the tempest patch, and honestly the game seemed decently balanced (well, some classes were OP and what not, but I mean the game in a macro sense). The damage cap limited people and forced hard bosses to be hard. Clean end-game and expensive gear were expensive, non-endgame stuff were affordable and a good substitute if you couldn't afford the expensive stuff. It also had variety of different equipment to go to, which came from different sources (ie: bosses), making the game fun and profitable if you could kill those different varieties of bosses. You could go loveless, empress, nova, helesium, tyrant, fafnir, normal stuff, etc and all of them were suitable depending on your funds.

But after unleashed, with the new damage cap, people hitting so much damage they can kill or even solo the end-game bosses faster and so often, it's driven those prices to the ground since there's so much in circulation and so little demand for them. The Root Abyss armors (some of them) are as low as 10m. It literally made some bosses useless, and have little to no incentive for people to kill them because they're not profitable. When do you think to yourself "Hey! Loveless Weapons is actually a good choice for me?" or "I'm going to do a Pink Bean run for profit!". Depending on your funding, Empress, SW or Fafnir is a much more economical alternative than Loveless will ever be. This holds true for lots of other things (ie: Horntail Pendants, Zakum Helmets).

The average mapler before used to be able to just form a party with 3~5 other people and tackle some bosses and use the boss spoils for profit, and there was variety to it. You could do Zakum runs for helmets, Scarlion and Targa runs for helmets, horntail runs for necklaces, toad boss for the staves, CWKPQ for a variety of stuff, and the list goes on. But now now all those are obsolete because of the adverse effects of the damage cap.

[b]tl;dr[/b]: Chaos setup a precedent that ruined class variety. Unleashed ruined the game.[/quote]

Nexon ruined other classes way before Chaos. Archers, Sairs and Thieves to an extent had a big advantage over other classes due to their accuracy. But Nexon basically did away with that when BB came. When WH were first released which was also around BB, they completely outclassed the adventurer archers in basically every single way possible. Before BB, Archers were squishy and had poor mobility/no FJ. Nexon gave WHs considerably more HP and much better mobility. From everything to damage and even Puppet, WH outclassed adventurer archers. Another example, Pre-BB, adventurer warriors had no FJ, but Nexon saw it fit to give them a FJ to DW.

They remove party play to solo play... If you can solo its better training alone </3

TOO BAD OUR OPINIONS MATTER 0% TO NEXON HUH GUYS

#LetsStartOurOwnCompany

Nah, it was just people complaining about everything.

[quote=SirKibbleX2]I somewhat agree, the only way you could change potential is if you cubed and those regular cubes suck. One of the 1st NX required things that greatly gave paying players an advantage. Made me quit, I tried cubing.. no way am I gonna cube THAT much.

Now things are better, cubes are easier to come by without nx. (Too bad I lost interest when Super cubes were there.. and then they gone)

I think all the patches were pretty much to blame, there are more revamps for the classes than to the monsters (and bosses but they get a few). No wonder normal monsters are always killed in 1 hit even if you are 10 levels below it.[/quote]

I read about some future patches where they increase both health and experience gained by monsters. Not sure if this is exactly a good or bad thing, but it seems interesting. Here's the link: [url=http://strategywiki.org/wiki/MapleStory/Major_updates]Patches[/url]

[quote=jonahthepwna]I had no idea that this was a thing. What do you mean?
Say if I went into a boss with 10k hp, it would deal 500 dmg, but if I had 1k, it would deal 50? I'm confused.[/quote]

Newer bosses have this, like Magnus and Gollux. Like they have 1hko moves, but they also have attacks that do 1/2 your HP. So whether you had 30k HP or 6k HP, you'll be at half.

[quote=snowdragon470]Lets not forget how new bosses now deal dmg based on a % of your hp, essentially to the bosses you being a paladin or a squishy jett are the same thing completely breaks the point of having different classes in some bosses[/quote]

I had no idea that this was a thing. What do you mean?
Say if I went into a boss with 10k hp, it would deal 500 dmg, but if I had 1k, it would deal 50? I'm confused.

Lets not forget how new bosses now deal dmg based on a % of your hp, essentially to the bosses you being a paladin or a squishy jett are the same thing completely breaks the point of having different classes in some bosses

I disagree, I think the potential system was fine. But I think the two biggest downfall for MapleStory was Chaos and Unleashed. [Incoming wall-of-text, tl;dr in the bottom].

The Chaos Patch itself wasn't terrible, but the buffs they gave to archers started a precedent that, in my opinion, began to ruin MapleStory. Before, every class had pros and cons. For example, ranged classes (nightlord, gunslingers, archers, etc) could deal damage, but they had to keep their distance or risk being one-shotted since they were squishy. For this reason, you would have a party, so that each class could help one another out. But the Chaos Patch gave Archers Spirit Link, one of the components to it was +40% HP. This began the precedent that all classes had to fit this "Jack-of-All-Traits" concept. Pretty much, every class has skills that give them extra HP, crit, double-jumps, etc that used to be exclusive to only one job. This sort of began to kill the diversity of playstyle in classes.

Next unleashed, probably the worst patch out there. I came back to the game on the tempest patch, and honestly the game seemed decently balanced (well, some classes were OP and what not, but I mean the game in a macro sense). The damage cap limited people and forced hard bosses to be hard. Clean end-game and expensive gear were expensive, non-endgame stuff were affordable and a good substitute if you couldn't afford the expensive stuff. It also had variety of different equipment to go to, which came from different sources (ie: bosses), making the game fun and profitable if you could kill those different varieties of bosses. You could go loveless, empress, nova, helesium, tyrant, fafnir, normal stuff, etc and all of them were suitable depending on your funds.

But after unleashed, with the new damage cap, people hitting so much damage they can kill or even solo the end-game bosses faster and so often, it's driven those prices to the ground since there's so much in circulation and so little demand for them. The Root Abyss armors (some of them) are as low as 10m. It literally made some bosses useless, and have little to no incentive for people to kill them because they're not profitable. When do you think to yourself "Hey! Loveless Weapons is actually a good choice for me?" or "I'm going to do a Pink Bean run for profit!". Depending on your funding, Empress, SW or Fafnir is a much more economical alternative than Loveless will ever be. This holds true for lots of other things (ie: Horntail Pendants, Zakum Helmets).

The average mapler before used to be able to just form a party with 3~5 other people and tackle some bosses and use the boss spoils for profit, and there was variety to it. You could do Zakum runs for helmets, Scarlion and Targa runs for helmets, horntail runs for necklaces, toad boss for the staves, CWKPQ for a variety of stuff, and the list goes on. But now now all those are obsolete because of the adverse effects of the damage cap.

[b]tl;dr[/b]: Chaos setup a precedent that ruined class variety. Unleashed ruined the game.

[quote=hgvd]Biggest for me is the community.
I can enjoy the game at a high level and without worrying about damage or funding even as an unfunded player.
I still have fun and it was always about the friendship I made.
in my opinion, the community died and I rest my blame in the players for killing the game.
I truly think too many of them were changed by potential/etc and wanted to get stornger and blamed Nexon for other things.
However, players like me were unaffected.[/quote]

See the problem with this, is that as a fellow Khaini player...
There are only like 1k people on in all of Khaini and half those people aren't reasonable people at all.
Of the little community that is left, I agree, they aren't the best.

Biggest for me is the community.
I can enjoy the game at a high level and without worrying about damage or funding even as an unfunded player.
I still have fun and it was always about the friendship I made.
in my opinion, the community died and I rest my blame in the players for killing the game.
I truly think too many of them were changed by potential/etc and wanted to get stornger and blamed Nexon for other things.
However, players like me were unaffected.

Nah, it was the players. The potential system wouldn't even exist if people didn't get so lazy and wanted the ability to solo everything.

I agree. Remember when bowmasters were highly respected because of hurricane? That's why I became one. Then half the classes got a skill like hurricane.

[quote=Waken]I think it'd be a lot of things contributing to the downfall of maplestory.

1) The Community. This is such a big factor and I'm not even going to lie right now. Before was nothing like this. I don't know if it's because the game is more damage oriented or because of how kids are raised nowadays, but it's ridiculous.
2) Buying cubes in the Cash Shop. I think that the potential system was fine as long as it stuck to the game itself and not paying for it. Being able to buy cubes, scrolls, and etc brought a lot of income, yes, but it also made the game super easy as long as you could blow money on the game. As a result of that, snobby kids get more snobby and the competition is raised.
3) Legendary/Bonus pots. Same issues with the second point, it just worsened the game even more.
4) The increase of damage cap? Sometimes, I don't consider this as an issue but I have to. There's just a huge difference of the strong players and the average-all due to how much you pay for this game.
5) The amount of classes in the game in such a short time. When I came back to maple, I came back to a load of other classes. Now that I've been here for a year, there's even more. We do not need a new class every month, lets stick to the ones we have and better them or the content in the game.[/quote]

I pray to God that Maplestory2 won't be as bad as the original has become...

I think it'd be a lot of things contributing to the downfall of maplestory.

1) The Community. This is such a big factor and I'm not even going to lie right now. Before was nothing like this. I don't know if it's because the game is more damage oriented or because of how kids are raised nowadays, but it's ridiculous.
2) Buying cubes in the Cash Shop. I think that the potential system was fine as long as it stuck to the game itself and not paying for it. Being able to buy cubes, scrolls, and etc brought a lot of income, yes, but it also made the game super easy as long as you could blow money on the game. As a result of that, snobby kids get more snobby and the competition is raised.
3) Legendary/Bonus pots. Same issues with the second point, it just worsened the game even more.
4) The increase of damage cap? Sometimes, I don't consider this as an issue but I have to. There's just a huge difference of the strong players and the average-all due to how much you pay for this game.
5) The amount of classes in the game in such a short time. When I came back to maple, I came back to a load of other classes. Now that I've been here for a year, there's even more. We do not need a new class every month, lets stick to the ones we have and better them or the content in the game.

And all the NX scrolls that make it easier to scroll too...
Like the protection scrolls and lucky day scrolls and things, where it would be "more effective" to buy NX to scroll your items

[quote=Plenair]Yeup, they should of done one or the other. Make everyone stronger by boosting stats or boost job skills.

OT:
Most have already settled that potentials killed the game. Anyone who disagrees because they like the big numbers is just a damage obsessed player.[/quote]

Eh, the old pot system (the one we had when BB first hit) was fine, the pot tiers we have NOW are beyond stupid. Legendary pots/Bonus pots are what really set the pay to win mode of the game.

Edit: Good example, some dude in the Ymck servers smega'd a ghost exorcist badge with 30% boss damage 20% boss damage and like some ignore defense % and damage %. All this on just one item (a badge no less) is completely pure BS and a turn off to people like me. There is no way in hell anyone is going to get that being an NX-Free player, it's just not possible and not fair in any sense of the game. The reason MS is dying is this reason, why should new players decide to play MS when Nexon is practically saying "come play Maplestory, where NX is not just a recommendation but a requirement to enjoy the game to the fullest". There are much better games out there that keep the playing level even, where skill as opposed to money spent means more.

And also, I kinda like how they made potentials slightly easier to use for people that don't buy NX with the other cubes(forgot what they're called), but they're still insanely rare -_-

[quote=Midget]the biggest factor is probably how nexon made everyone powerful as butt and have broken skills that hit like half the map and do 500 quintillion lines of damage while 1-hitting everyone so that you can easily play solo and not have to party[/quote]

See, I kinda feel that the POT system helped with this. With the rediculous %'s of stats, people can still hit insanely high even without those broken skills...

the biggest factor is probably how nexon made everyone powerful as butt and have broken skills that hit like half the map and do 500 quintillion lines of damage while 1-hitting everyone so that you can easily play solo and not have to party

The biggest factor to me that made the game less appealing would be the community. Some people are just straight out immature and/or rude while some aren't. If you can find people who aren't rude, immature, and so on the game can still be fun.

I'd agree, but like all games that have damage as part of the main obejective of the game, companies make the numbers higher and higher, examples like the unleashed patch and in runescape they made numbers go from 10 to 100