General

Isn't final charge supposed to have 100% knockback rate? It takes way too long right now to line up a group of monsters together.

My input is under the assumption that GMS isn't willing to do anything but number tweak and doesn't want to have to implement new mechanics. Mobs hit has to stay at 8, and I'd argue if they choose to keep Tempest nerf it should be upped to 10. The fact that the Final Blow change increases number of lines is great, but numerically it does slightly less damage than the current one. Comboless Final Blow will do 1800% rather than 1900%. It should be 320% per hit, not 300. Commandless should be 400% at the least, if not 410. If they do listen to us and don't nerf Tempest, I'd still like to see the command removed. As a controller user (60% Keyboard life) I can't tell you how many times I proc Tempest instead of FC or FB (MS does not accept the keymappings I bind my controller to, so I can't use the D-Pad for movement). Overswing is outshined by just mashing FB already, not to mention FBBB. If they choose to let us chain OS in to FB again, I think OS should be able to chain in to BB. Even if it doesn't outdps FBBB theres no harm in having the combo there. Is allowing us to combo as simple as reducing the delay after the last hit? If so theres no reason we shouldn't get OSFBBB back. Last on my list is drain. IMO drain is a part of our identity and is always one of the advantages of aran when people are trying to decide what character to make. Making it so much less effective takes away part of our uniqueness. As many others have said, 5% max HP would be much better as 2% will basically help me stay topped off at SH and that's it.

Congrats, I thought you would be the representative for us. I agree with linking OSFBBB because it's what made me want to make the class when it came out, and why leave it like that in the beginner quest if you can't do it in game. Along with combo drain, shade's is 1% and that really doesn't heal hardly anything and 2% won't make much of a difference, so maybe instead of 20% of damage it could be changed to 10% or 5% dmg since the hp% heals aren't very good at all. Combo Unlimited should give us something better just like you said, maybe something to help with bossing. The nerfs to our mobbing is going to make us a more balanced sort of class instead of one that is known for mobbing and decent bossing. The nerf to the damage on FB and BB seem to be just a tad too much. But everything else seems to help a bit more

@Feeling I see... Well congrats first of all on becoming the representative of Arans. As everyone is saying here, our biggest problem right now is Tempest and it's either they bring it back to it's original state or they replace it with something else that is as powerful. Also, this may not affect us gameplay wise but I'm pretty sure most of us are waiting on our retouched storyline and "reboot" I guess is what you would call it?

[quote=Javirocks]Yo, I've been gone for long, what is the MLC? Sorry I just really haven't been on maple for a while.[/quote]

Welcome back! [url=http://maplestory.nexon.net/community/#%2Fshowthread.php%3F1418260-ANNOUNCEMENT-Maple-Leaf-Council-v2-0!%26nxid%3D6]This explains it pretty well.[/url]

Yo, I've been gone for long, what is the MLC? Sorry I just really haven't been on maple for a while.

@TacoLOL:
Ahh gotcha. And yeah i have noticed that.

I don't have anything else to add that already isn't here, I agree 100% with everything and hope they listen to our words.

[quote=jrealdeal]That is intentional.
If you use the Key Bound version, you do more damage (and feels like its Range is lil bigger, Not 100% sure on that) but it costs you 30 Combos.
The Combo version, from pressing Down+att is notably weaker, but doesn't use combos.[/quote]

Sorry, I meant the difference in range...

Congrats @Feeling on become The Symbol Of the Arans for the Maple leaf Council! I believe someone like you has earned it!

On that note,about the class on my opinion. I think that the Class felt smooth while playing it back when i first created my Aran,i still have my Combo King Medal, and kept it as a memory for my Aran. And as of the Class Now;I think it is okay,i mean in general 50-50. I am sad that we can't do the natural chain OSFBBB, but it is still a good class to play with.

[quote=TacoLOL]I hope all the small things are fixed, like the difference between the Final Blow keybind and keyboard shortcut...[/quote]

That is intentional.
If you use the Key Bound version, you do more damage (and feels like its Range is lil bigger, Not 100% sure on that) but it costs you 30 Combos.
The Combo version, from pressing Down+att is notably weaker, but doesn't use combos.

I hope all the small things are fixed, like the difference between the Final Blow keybind and keyboard shortcut...

Besides what people have already said, I'd like to see the mob count we can hit increased again. I don't understand why they keep lowering it. We used to be able to hit 12 then it became 8 and now 6?

I feel like combo should also play a bigger role rather than just being needed for certain skills. For example, certain boosts showing up at the side requiring the use of combo. Increased attack speed, more damage etc.

People covered most of what I wanted to say. Hopefully in a future revamp we get refreshed animations though.

It would be cool if the regular animation for final attack gets replaced with an animation of your wolf mount attacking the enemy. Well, that is if the mount was obtained.

I personally would like to see our skills combo together more. In light of the way Toss will work being that we jump up with the mobs. It would be cool that when airborne, if we did OS mid air, the player and mobs being hit would slowly fall, doing slightly more damage while airborne, or as an alternative, one could cast Judgement while in the air to slam mobs back down to the ground doing bonus damage to the mobs in air and near the impact area. We need to be the Combo King again. And not just a combo counter. I want to see all skills flow together. not just OS+FB+BB.

The current Drain doesn't even heal max hp, just heals your base hp, idk when this changed (it has alwaus been this way I just never noticed due not having much +hp or %hp before, plus its so op it never really mattered), either way >.> I'm tired of all these crappy skill descriptions/misleading text/nonsense math that nexon does. Someone call me when they fix all this. *I'll be back in 6 months maybe*

Everyone pretty much summed it up.

Swirlled, since you're on track to become the first 250 Aran in GMS, I'd like to see you rally up the council members and push forward for those who've achieved Lv.250 be recognized in their respective towns (via NPC).

[quote=Rokani]I use it...

As for making OSFBBB worthwhile using, keep the same attack speed but after finishing the combo Maha spawns and does a devastating finishing attack, like a FA but way more powerful letting you move on to the next attack or re-positioning your self.[/quote]
Regardless, Rolling Spin is a near-useless skill with low damage and low utility; replacing it with High Defense from 4th job (and replacing High Defense with an Enrage-like skill) is a better option now that our Drain skill is average at best.
As for the an additional Maha attack after BB, it seems a bit unfitting as Maha already delivers the finishing blow with the 3rd animation on BB.

[quote=hyperfire7]Removed Skill - Rolling Spin (who the heck uses this skill?)[/quote]

I use it...

As for making OSFBBB worthwhile using, keep the same attack speed but after finishing the combo Maha spawns and does a devastating finishing attack, like a FA but way more powerful letting you move on to the next attack or re-positioning your self.

I like whats been said so far, cant disagree with anything.

but one of my favorite things about aran was our spammable ultimate and how it made us mobbing gods...

When I first started playing maple i chose Ice Lightning mage:
1. Because the ice lightning theme.
2. Because of the spammable ultimate.

When magicians ultimates got nerfed my brother quit MS, I would have quit too but then arans came out, and since they were Ice themed, I started playing them. I couldn't be happier when Tempest became spammable, I had everything I'd wanted in I/l back with my aran. I love Arans and im pretty sad that they are putting a CD on tempest.

[quote=Feeling]Somebody give @hyperfire7: a medal. Summed up everything we need, and even included reasonable numbers.
I saved all of that, and it will definitely be brought up in my council suggestions.[/quote]

I made slight revisions. Copy/save it again if you wish.
Another slight beef that I have with Arans atm that might not be applicable to KMS is that when party members receive the Maha's Blessing buff, the golden circle---that I assume is supposed to appear on top of the character's head---appears like 600 pixels to the right.
And I'll say it again, I really hope GMS listens to the feedback of you MLC elects and acts accordingly.

Somebody give @hyperfire7: a medal. Summed up everything we need, and even included reasonable numbers.
I saved all of that, and it will definitely be brought up in my council suggestions.

[quote=hyperfire7]Here are my inputs, forgive me if some of the following was repeated since I didn't read all the posts yet. I bolded the ones where I've made a significant change to the skill.

Gameplay change: Command key attacks now do the same amount of damage as keybinded attacks.
Skill changes:

[i]1st job:[/i]
Combo Smash - Damage % halved, hit count increased from 1 to 2. Cast delay decreased from 840ms to 650ms.
[b][i]Combat Step - Can now cancel all previous attacking and buffing animations.[/b][/i]

[i]2nd job:[/i]
[b][i]Body Pressure - Stun chance removed. While this buff is active, all attacking skills now lowers enemy defense by 6% at 100% rate and can stack up to 5 times for a maximum of -30% enemy defense (# of stacks will be shown on enemies just like Freezing Crush does for I/L Archmages). Attacks from party members benefit from this status.[/b][/i]
Combo Drain - HP recovered increased from 2% HP healed per hit to 5% per hit.
Combo Fenrir - Damage % halved, hit count increased from 2 to 4. Cast delay decreased from 840ms to 650ms.
Final Charge - Cast delay when using this skill after Triple Swing, Full Swing, Over Swing, Final Blow, and Beyonder is reduced.
[b][i]Snow Charge - Ice element removed. Slowed enemies now take 10% additional damage. Attacks from party members benefit from this status. Slow effect now applies to all bosses.[/b][/i]

[i]3rd Job:[/i]
[b][i]Combo Judgment - Damaged decreased from 480% to 360%, hit count increased from 4 to 6. Causes a debuff where all your attack skills will have their damage increased by 10% for 15 seconds. Cast delay decreased from 900ms to 750ms. Cooldown of 5 seconds added.[/b][/i]
Final Toss - Cast delay when using this skill after Full Swing, Over Swing, Final Blow, and Beyonder is reduced.
Full Swing - Double Swing damage decreased from 260% to 220%, hit count increased from 2 to 3. Triple Swing damaged decreased from 740% to 280%, hit count increased from 1 to 3. Attack range increased.
Rolling Spin - Removed (who the heck uses that skill?)
[b][i]NEW SKILL - Focused Imperil: [url=http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11113/111136241/3516845-9595927112-34886.jpg]Fueled by the energy from Aran's beast spirits[/url], your damage is increased while concentrating all your attacks on 1 enemy.[/b][/i]
[b][i]Max skill level: 20. At max skill level: MP -150, ATT +25%. Mob hit count of all attacks decreased to 1. Toggle ON/OFF skill.[/b][/i]
*Skill animation should consist something of the beast spirits giving energy to the player.

[i]4th job:[/i]
Advanced Final Attack - Hit count increased from 1 to 2.
[b][i]Combo Tempest - Can instantly 1HKO non-boss monsters without having to use the skill twice. For boss monsters: Damage reduced from 790% to 450%, hit count increased from 4 to 8. Causes a debuff where all your attack skills will have their damage increased by 15% for 30 seconds. Debuff effect does not stack with Combo Judgment. Cast delay decreased from 1440ms to 1000ms.[/b][/i]
High Defense - Max HP bonus increased from 20% to 40%.
Final Blow - Number of monsters hit increased from 6 to 8.
Over Swing - Double Swing damage decreased from 625% to 340%, hit count increased from 2 to 4. Triple Swing damage decreased from 725% to 400%, hit count increased from 2 to 4. Attack range increased. [b][i]Can now be chained with Final Blow or Beyonder.[/b][/i]

[i]Hyper Skill:[/i]
Beyonder - 1st animation's damage increased from 450% to 500%. 3rd animation's damage decreased from 550% to 500%. Number of monsters hit increased from 6 to 8.
Combo Unlimited - Removed
[b][i]NEW SKILL - Combo Ultimatum[/b][/i]: While this skill is active, all combo cost will be reduced to 0 and all your attacking skills will now bind enemies for 5 seconds. The duration of the bind status on an enemy resets for each attack you do on that enemy. Duration of Combo Ultimatum = 20 seconds (thus for a maximum bind time of 25 seconds if you attack an enemy during the entire 20 second duration of the buff). Cooldown of 120 second.[/b][/i]
*This buff skill's animation will be the same as Combo Unlimited.

Reasons:
1a) Animation cancelling is pretty much needed for our class at higher end bosses. I lost count how many times I died at CVB and HMagnus while in the middle of Beyonder. I added it to Combat Step since that skill is the most apropos for this utility.
1b) For that reason above, I thought the increasing damage of 450% -> 500% -> 550% for Beyonder was stupid. What if you can only do 1 or 2 of the 3 Beyonder animations before you have to cancel it to dodge an attack? Thus I made Beyonder's damage a constant 500% for all 3 animations.
1c) Using OS -> FB -> BB is nice and all, and action canceling from Combat Step is great. But making BB available only after FB doesn't do justice for a combo class like us. We should be able to customize what combo moves we can use in battle, thus I made BB usable after just OS, so we can do all of the following when dishing out DPS-oriented attacks:
OS -> FB -> BB
OS -> BB
FB -> BB
2) Snow Charge's ice element makes the active damage increase buff pointless, so I removed it.
3) Body Pressure is a useless skill and Combo Judgment and Combo Tempest are also useless in boss runs, so I added some utility to all three.
4) We need to be more effective in bossing situations, but simply increasing the lines and damage % of our attack skills would make us too OP at mobbing. Thus, Focused Imperil is the best solution. People may complain this is just a rip-off from Hero's Enrage skill, but this is the best way to solve our below-average bossing capabilities.
5) I think the cooldown of 15 seconds on Combo Tempest is justified since being the only class with a spam-able ultimate is too OP. Thus I returned the mob hit count of Final Blow and Beyonder to the way it was pre-Reboot and also increased the range of Full Swing and Over Swing to compensate. Tempest however needs to 1HKO non-boss monsters. Using the skill twice wastes time and is annoying.
6) We needed either a crash or a bind skill, but since crash is an adventurer warrior's staple, I added a bind skill instead. It replaces Combo Unlimited because that skill is rendered useless with Combo Tempest's cooldown. The damage boost from the new Combo Unlimited was thus relocated to Combo Judgment/Combo Tempest.
7) We also need to improve the gameplay for lower level Arans. For a combo oriented class, the hit count of all the skills---aside from FB and BB---were very low, so I increased the hit counts while decreasing the damage.
8) The boost for the total sum of damage % for Beyonder was good, but all our other skills were still lacking in damage % so I increased the total sum of damage % for many of our skills.

I hope GMS takes this Council thing seriously and make some changes independent of KMS---like GMS did with Luminous and Kaiser---because KMS clearly doesn't know the crippling faults of multiple classes, not just Arans.[/quote]

Love this idea

@hyperfire7 Holy ****. I shed tears while reading that! Seriously! I love that you added combat step canceling buff animations also, would be great after using somethings like CU, CB, or Heroic Memories. Theres still a delay after using them and the buff activates before it ends, so being able to cancel the animation immediately would be pretty awesome at bosses. After seeing the changes you thought of for OS I thought that BB should also be able to be used directly after OS. I think they decreased the delay in the recent KMS patches, if they keep that change when Reboot hits gms I think OS -> FB, OS -> BB, and OS -> FB -> BB would all be viable combinations. In the end I'd really like to see Aran being able to use all skills in succession to eachother, would really bring back those combo roots I've heard so much about.

@Feeling: Perhaps whenever the full combo is used, it would have higher damage, more lines, faster attacking speed, etc, as well as having the option to break the chain with Combat Step or Final Charge at any moment, similar to Shade's Backstep. I believe this would resurface the original concept of our class, while not penalizing us at end-game bosses.

Thank you for reading this portion of text I wrote, I thought this was a great idea for tlhe next step of Aran. I sure hope it works out for us!

Here are my inputs, forgive me if some of the following were repeated since I didn't read all of the posts yet. I bolded the ones where I've made a significant change to the skill.

Gameplay change: Command key attacks now do the same amount of damage as keybinded attacks.
Skill changes:

[i]1st job:[/i]
Combo Smash - Damage % halved, hit count increased from 1 to 2. Cast delay decreased from 840ms to 750ms.
[b][i]Combat Step - Can now cancel all previous attacking and buffing animations upon use.[/b][/i]

[i]2nd job:[/i]
[b][i]Body Pressure - Stun chance removed. Body Attack effect removed. Now while this buff is active, all your attack skills have a chance to lower enemy defense at a certain rate, which can stack up to 5 times (# of stacks will be shown on enemies just like Freezing Crush does for I/L Archmages).[/b][/i]
[b][i]At level 1: Lowers enemy defense by 2% at a 40% rate (for a maximum of -10% enemy defense when stacked 5 times)[/b][/i]
[b][i]At level 5 (max): Lowers enemy defense by 6% at a 80% rate (for a maximum of -30% enemy defense when stacked 5 times)[/b][/i]
Combo Drain - HP recovered increased from 2% HP healed per hit to 5% per hit.
Combo Fenrir - Damage % halved, hit count increased from 2 to 4. Cast delay decreased from 840ms to 750ms.
Final Charge - Cast delay when using this skill after Triple Swing, Full Swing, Over Swing, Final Blow, and Beyonder is reduced.
[b][i]Snow Charge - Ice element removed. Slowed enemies now take 10% additional damage. Attacks from party members benefit from this damage bonus. Slow effect now applies to all bosses.[/b][/i]

[i]3rd Job:[/i]
Cleaving Blows - Defense ignored reduced from 40% to 30%.
[b][i]Combo Judgment - Damage decreased from 480% to 360%, hit count increased from 4 to 6. Immediately grants a self-only buff upon use of this skill where your damage is increased by 10% for 15 seconds. Cast delay decreased from 900ms to 800ms. Cooldown of 5 seconds added.[/b][/i]
Final Toss - Cast delay when using this skill after Final Charge, Full Swing, Over Swing, Final Blow, and Beyonder is reduced.
Full Swing - Double Swing damage decreased from 260% to 210%, hit count increased from 2 to 3. Triple Swing damage decreased from 740% to 260%, hit count increased from 1 to 3. Attack range increased.
Removed Skill - Rolling Spin (who the heck uses this skill?)
[b][i]NEW SKILL - High Defense: Increases Max HP and decreases damage taken.[/b][/i]
[b][i]At level 1: Damage taken -6.5%, Max HP +21%.[/b][/i]
[b][i]At level 20 (max): Damage taken -20%, Max HP +40%.[/b][/i]
*Compared to the current High Defense's damage taken -20%, Max HP +20%.

[i]4th job:[/i]
Advanced Final Attack - Hit count increased from 1 to 2.
[b][i]Combo Tempest - Now instantly 1-hit-KOs non-boss monsters with a single use. For boss monsters: Damage reduced from 790% to 450%, hit count increased from 4 to 8. Immediately grants a self-only buff upon use of this skill where your damage is increased by 15% for 30 seconds. This buff does not stack with Combo Judgment's buff. Cast delay decreased from 1440ms to 1150ms.[/b][/i]
Removed Skill - High Defense (moved to 3rd job).
[b][i]NEW SKILL - Focused Imperil: [url=http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11113/111136241/3516845-9595927112-34886.jpg]Fueled by the energy from Aran's beast spirits[/url], your total attack is increased while concentrating all your attack skills on 1 enemy. Toggle ON/OFF skill.[/b][/i]
[b][i]At level 1: MP -150, ATT +26%. Monster hit count on all attack skills decreased to 1 while this skill is active.[/b][/i]
[b][i]At level 10: MP -200, ATT +35%. Monster hit count on all attack skills decreased to 1 while this skill is active.[/b][/i]
[b][i]At level 20 (max): MP -250, ATT +45%. Monster hit count on all attack skills decreased to 1 while this skill is active.[/b][/i]
*Skill animation should consist something of the beast spirits giving energy to the player.
Final Blow - Number of monsters hit increased from 6 to 8.
Over Swing - Double Swing damage decreased from 625% to 360%, hit count increased from 2 to 4. Triple Swing damage decreased from 725% to 420%, hit count increased from 2 to 4. Attack range increased. [b][i]Can now be chained with Final Blow or Beyonder after use.[/b][/i]

[i]Hyper Skill:[/i]
Beyonder - 1st animation's damage increased from 450% to 500%. 3rd animation's damage decreased from 550% to 500%. Number of monsters hit increased from 6 to 8. [b]Damage boost that is given for each monster you hit less is removed[/b].
Removed Skill - Combo Unlimited
[b][i]NEW SKILL - Combo Ultimatum: While this skill is active, all combo cost will be reduced to 0 and all your attack skills will now bind enemies for 5 seconds. The duration of the bind status on an enemy resets for every attack you do on that enemy while this buff is active.[/b][/i]
[b][i]Buff duration: 20 seconds (thus for a maximum bind time of 25 seconds if you attack an enemy during the entire 20 second duration). Cooldown: 120 seconds.[/b][/i]
*This buff skill's animation will be the same as Combo Unlimited, but the cast delay should be reduced by about 200~250ms since the current Combo Unlimited's cast delay would be too long for buff that only lasts 20 seconds.

Reasons:
1a) Animation cancelling is needed for our class at higher end bosses. I lost count how many times I died at Chaos Von Bon and Hard Magnus while in the middle of Beyonder. I added it to Combat Step since that skill is the most apropos for this utility.
1b) For the reason above, the increasing damage percents of 450% -> 500% -> 550% for Beyonder makes no sense. What if you can only do one of the three Beyonder animations before you have to cancel it to dodge an attack? Thus I made Beyonder's damage a constant 500% for all 3 animations.
1c) Bringing back OS -> FB -> BB is nice and all, and action canceling from Combat Step is great. But making BB available only after FB doesn't do justice for a combo class like us. We should be able to customize what combo moves we can use in battle, thus I made BB also usable after OS, so we can do all of the following when dishing out DPS-oriented attacks:
OS -> FB -> BB
OS -> BB
FB -> BB
2) Snow Charge's ice element makes the active damage increase buff pointless on end-game bosses as their elemental resistance will make you do less damage than having Snow Charge turned off, so I removed the ice element.
3) Body Pressure is a near-useless skill and Combo Judgment and Combo Tempest are also useless at bossing, so I added some utility to all three.
4) Combining the 'defense ignored' attribute on Cleaving Blow and my revision on Body Pressure would make us too OP, so I nerfed Cleaving Blow's defense ignore.
5a) We need to be more effective in bossing situations, but simply increasing the lines and damage % of our attack skills would make us too OP at mobbing. Thus, Focused Imperil is the best solution. People may complain this is just a rip-off from Hero's Enrage skill, but this is the best way to solve our below-average bossing capabilities without making us unbalanced.
5b) Having the damage boost on Beyonder for each monster you hit less on top of Focused Imperil would make Beyonder too strong, so I removed Beyonder's damage boost given for hitting less number of targets.
5c) Focused Imperil is obviously intended to help us in bossing, so making it into a 4th job skill is the best choice. To make room for this skill in 4th job, I moved High Defense to 3rd job as Arans could use the additional HP and damage reduction abilities earlier now, since Combo Drain is no longer the OP drain skill it once was that compensated for our well-below average HP pool as a warrior class. I also buffed High Defense's HP bonus for that reason.
6) I think the cooldown of 15 seconds on Combo Tempest is justified since being the only class with a spam-able ultimate would make us too OP. However, reducing the enemies hit with Final Blow and Beyonder tarnishes our class's specialty as a great mobber, so I returned the mob hit count of Final Blow and Beyonder to the way it was pre-Reboot and also increased the attacking range of Full Swing and Over Swing to compensate. Tempest needs to 1-hit-KO non-boss monsters though; using the skill twice in a row wastes time and is annoying and pointless.
7) We either need a crash or a bind skill, but since crash is an adventurer warrior's staple, I added Combo Ultimatum as a bind skill instead. It replaces Combo Unlimited because that skill is rendered useless with Combo Tempest's cooldown. The damage boost from the Reboot patch's Combo Unlimited was relocated to Combo Judgment/Combo Tempest.
8) We also need to improve the gameplay for lower level Arans. For a combo oriented class, the hit count of all attack skills---aside from FB and BB, but those are higher level skills---were very low, so I increased the hit counts while decreasing the damage to compensate.
9) The boost for the total sum of damage % for Beyonder was good, but all our other skills were still lacking in damage % (especially Over Swing) so I increased the total sum of damage % for many of our skills slightly.

A graphical update to our aging skill animations (except our Hyper Skills) would be nice as well.

I hope GMS takes this Council thing seriously and make some changes independent of KMS---like GMS did with Luminous and Kaiser---because the test servers for the Reboot patch demonstrated that KMS developers clearly didn't understand how to appropriately balance each class (i.e. the ridiculous cooldown on Paladin's Blast in KMST 1.2.010 that crippled their DPM).

Hello Feeling,
I haven't been in the MapleStory scene for a while, so I have to catch up with the latest Aran news and such.
However, one thing that I have really wanted since I reached level 200 back in 2011 is having the Aran NPC site (can't recall name, if any) fixed in Rien. I'm not sure if Nexon has released any information on that, but I'm quite certain that it hasn't been updated since Arans were first introduced. It would be cool to have the older Aran's have their NPC's displayed there.

@Feeling I suggest that Combo Unlimited should allow tempest to be used without using combos and without a cooldown while it's active. Like i said before, if Nexon thinks that's still to "unbalanced" then using tempest while CU is active should cost 50 to 100 combos(depending on the build you used for hypers) and the cooldown should still be removed for those 30 seconds. I mean, the only time I ever see people actually spam Tempest is after using Combo Unlimited cause that's kind of the whole point of the buff . Oh and I knew that Tempest overrides Fenrir, but I see that with it being turned into a hot key skill now the command for Fenrir would be open. Looking at everything everyone else has said, I'd have to say that I agree with their comments and suggestions wholeheartedly. Kinda new to the Aran class, well Maple in general(6 months) and it's great to see that the class I've chosen has such a great and similar thinking community.

Edit:I also think the whole key-command doing less damage that the hotkey thing should be scrapped altogether. Thought it was kind of silly the first time i got to 100 and still do. They should both do the same damage(the higher % damage of course, inb4 Nexowned) and it should be a matter of preference as to which one you use.

Just to reiterate some of the points made in this thread so far, and to add my observations~ I'll edit the original post to add this stuff as well.
I believe the overall changes people are looking for are to gain our class's roots back with skill chaining, and I think there are definitely some ways we can go about this, and slightly readjusting the concept to be useful in the current state of the game and its bosses.

The most sought after change seems to be the re-addition of the OS+FB+BB combo, and I completely agree, with some beneficial changes.
Chaining multiple attacks together was the original allure of our class, and it should stay that way.
The entire OSFBBB combo should not be mandatory--we should still be able to use FB+BB when we want--but changes should be made to encourage using the full combo. Perhaps whenever the full combo is used, it would have higher damage, more lines, faster attacking speed, etc, as well as having the option to break the chain with Combat Step or Final Charge at any moment, similar to Shade's Backstep. I believe this would resurface the original concept of our class, while not penalizing us at end-game bosses.

Snow Charge's new buff to bosses is quite useless, since basically all bosses that matter are strong to ice. A change should be made so that this effect is applied to ice-resistant bosses, perhaps by removing the ice charge from the buff itself.

Combo Drain should be readjusted as well. The new 2% is pretty awful. It doesn't need to be as high as the current 20%, but 2% is quite low--it should be buffed to 5%, like @Rokani: suggested.

About Combo Unlimited's usefulness- with Tempest not being usable consecutively, Combo Unlimited is pretty useless, aside from saving you a couple combos here and there. It does offer 10% extra damage, but this hardly makes up for the change. Some other type of buff or mechanic should be added to this hyper, any suggestions?

For Tempest- I think the nerf was unneeded. Ever since Aran was released, we have always been a class for mobbing. Because of this, we were never great bossers, and we still aren't, even after the KMS buff. With the nerf to Tempest, we're now mediocre bossers and hardly average mobbers--jack of all trades, master of none. Tempest is a great skill, and with the current combo stacking system, I think it's quite balanced. We get 30 seconds of amazing mobbing with Combo Unlimited, with a 60 second cooldown to balance everything out. I think the current system with Tempest / CU is the last thing standing that makes us outstanding mobbers--what we were meant to be--and I think we should push to have it stay this way.

@GiveLess : the KMS update says the command for Tempest was removed, meaning it's now a hotkey skill. The reason we can't use Fenrir is because its command is the same as Tempest's, and Tempest overrides it. Since Tempest no longer uses this same command, I believe this means we will be able to use Fenrir freely.

@Rate : the recent KMS update did change Final Charge to move us whether there are mobs present or not, so no need to worry about that. I agree with your other suggestions, but I think Beyond Blade should remain as is. The button mashing is sort of our class signature. xD

@MapleBhav : Absolutely, I believe we are the only warrior class without some form of crash or bind. We even have the whole ice element going for us, we should definitely have some sort of freeze bind.

@Smexdemon: What gear do you use ?

Forgot to mention, since they killed the usefulness of combo unlimited and its true purpose. (Even with the 10% damage boost for 30secs) They should just change that to a bind or magic crash skill.

[quote=superswift12]@Smexdemon: @Smexdemon: Oh okay xP ... I was just wondering the benefit of SW gear was, this is considering the fact that i have LHC equipment. I don't have much mesos to afford things, however, never have ... Also, are there any good training spots from lvl 180 - 200 besides SH ? Thanks.[/quote]

SH is probably the best place to train

Congratz on getting the position! I believe I also nominated you ^^
Some concerns:
- Drain: Everyone has probably mentioned it, but the supposedly coming nerf is a bit concerning. I mean, come on 2%? If we were to push hp-washing aside, then I would like to argue that we are probably the lowest hp warrior class. Even my NL friend has more hp than my Aran! Like some people suggested, at least 5% would be okay.

- Unlimited Combo vs Combo Recharge: Main useful usage of Unlimited Combo was pretty much to spam Tempest. With the Tempest nerf, this skill basically becomes pointless. In the end combos are mainly used to buff/re-buff Drain and Combo Barrier, a total of 90 combos. Combo Recharge charges 200 combos, which makes our hyper Unlimited Combo redundant considering the hyper has a 90 second CD whereas Unlimited Combo only has a 50 second CD.

- Tempest: I find this skill really useful, especially at stronghold. The 10+ multi-kills makes training and attendance much easier and faster. Tempest is pretty much similar to Demon Slayer's Devil Cry. I know it's also getting nerfed, but if we're both getting nerfed then it should be somewhat equal: Devil Cry: cooldown of 16 seconds has been added, this cooldown is decreased by 8 seconds while Infinity Force is active. L>8s CD/CD reduction and wth @ 1k remaining hp.....maybe I'm just being nit-picky at this point, but I also think it should best be left as it was before: dmg% vs monster.

If it were possible, I would suggest to Nexon not to nerf Tempest. Other reasons include:

1) What unfairness? People will argue it's unfair for Arans to have a map ultimate. First of all, it lasts only 30 seconds. BMs have Arrow Blaster which they can place on one side of the map. At max level, Arrow Blaster is also 30 seconds. Fair in my book. Buccs have Buccaneer Blast which can activate Double Blast which extends the entire bottom platform at West Leafre Forest and a good portion of sdh/fdh (as an example). Considering the range, you can almost consider it a map ultimate. Fair in my book? Yes. Considering the skills of some other classes, I would hardly consider Tempest unfair.

2) If it's unfair, it's sort of unfair to us? Arans cannot hold and spam their main attack which most, if not all, of the remaining MS population can. Considering this, Tempest can be considered a fair exchange. Even so, we still can't hold a key and continuously spam Tempest. We have to use multiple keys and as problematic as it was already, Tempest is going to be nerfed. Honestly, Tempest was part of the fun in Arans.

Lol, I apologize for the length of this post and if I sounded like I was ranting. XD

@Smexdemon: @Smexdemon: Oh okay xP ... I was just wondering the benefit of SW gear was, this is considering the fact that i have LHC equipment. I don't have much mesos to afford things, however, never have ... Also, are there any good training spots from lvl 180 - 200 besides SH ? Thanks.

Personally I'd like to see a longer chain attack be viable (ie OS->FB->BB) but I'd like it to combo the way zero does for its multi-cast skills where they can cast things like Giga Crash -> Falling Star -> Earth Break with small delays in between, whereas if we stop to move for a bit in between our chain attack we have to start from the beginning of the combo again. This way it'll be much easier to actually utilize a combo with such a huge total cast time, since we can actually move around and dodge in between hits (say, in magnus or something).

[quote=superswift12]TBH, i don't really like drain, I don't see what's so good about the skill haha .... i'm not really sure about how aran is going to be with all the decreases in the skills, I don't really like the changes at all. The first step nexon did is remove party-play at SH and HOH. Now this.

On a side note, yo swirrled, it's probably the most i could ask for from the aran community is to help me get to lvl 200. It's been a goal since 2007, i'm by far one of the oldest arans, with the combo king medal. I am not aiming for the 250 level cap, i'm going to stick to my origins. Thanks. Anything is appreciated.[/quote]

Drain helps save pots bro. plus the drain in kms gives %max hp but tht won't help at all since most end game bosses do %dmg such as magnus. I'm also pretty sure arans are getting buffed

TBH, i don't really like drain, I don't see what's so good about the skill haha .... i'm not really sure about how aran is going to be with all the decreases in the skills, I don't really like the changes at all. The first step nexon did is remove party-play at SH and HOH. Now this.

On a side note, yo swirrled, it's probably the most i could ask for from the aran community is to help me get to lvl 200. It's been a goal since 2007, i'm by far one of the oldest arans, with the combo king medal. I am not aiming for the 250 level cap, i'm going to stick to my origins. Thanks. Anything is appreciated.

I should have been chosen!

An option to skip the intro would be nice.

What are your major concerns? Arans combo ability and ability to link skills is becoming useless.

Are you satisfied with the direction Nexon is taking our class? No.

In light of the recent KMS update, are you satisfied with the changes? Some.

Anyways, already told you most of it but might as well do it again just in case something new pops up or it helps spark ideas for others. Let the rant begin!

First KMS changes (In no order):
~Drain: Drain was a tad bit overkill, sure 20% was quite a lot but 2% only lets us regain 5% - 10% HP per second, compared to bowmen this is nothing and BaM's isn't too bad due to their attack speed. 5% HP per hit would seem way more balanced, 12% - 25% hp healed per second.
~Tempest: Completely useless in bossing, needs some utility or massive damage, and now useless for mobbing, though I suppose if your damage is really low it allows you to kill strong mobs...
~Snow Charge: Nice but it'll be useless on high end bosses, still nice though.
~Combo ability: Decreasing the usefulness of combos once again, though it is better stability....
Everything else I approve of and I'm grateful for.

As for the direction Nexon is taking us?
~I feel like they don't have a clue what to do with us nor do they have much care to put a great deal of effort into the class. (Are we in the gutter dying atm? I feel like each update makes us more of a generic class) EX: OSFBBB combo was slow, and quite likely, would get you killed for poor damage. To fix this they simply upped the damage and removed half the combo while they could of improved the combo and have made it a high risk high reward type deal, with a counterpart that would just be FBBB as a medium risk medium reward and OS as low risk low reward. They also did the same thing for all the finishers, why not make FT more effective if you chain it to something else? Or if it's not chained decrease how effective it is.
~As for why I feel like were becoming more generic, they gave a street fighter type class the ability to not chain finishers and make it better that way AND let you bind direction/key combination attacks (EX: FB) onto a key while making it stronger.... WTF?

What I want:
OSFBBB combo back, not forced to use it though just makes for a powerful attack if used. All skills to be chain-able. A way to cancel a combo if needed, even if it cost you something to do so. Increased effectiveness for chaining attacks. Combos to be more useful, perhaps each combo finisher should have a utility with it? No CD on tempest, make it use all you'r combos for all I care. Tempest to be useful in both bossing and mobbing. Were squishy, we will die a lot with only 10% hp back when mobs will be doing 30% - 50% damage to us every second... 12 mobs hit with OS. And last, though not least, Maha the Polearm.

[quote=Star909]I was saying it should stay a warrior exclusive but I realized that Mihile also has magic crash. Either way I think they should stay exclusive to those 4 classes.[/quote]
I mean it probably wouldn't be Magic Crash, so that skill would still stay exclusive.

Congrats on being a part of the MLC! You definitely deserved it!

I'm still not sure how I feel about the changes in KMS. Drain nerf is going to make my life even worse (like I don't die enough haha). Snow charge bonus damage against bosses seems useless if the bosses are resistant. Tempest nerf will kill my soul. It'd be nice to have a shorter animation time on BB as well... Final toss is going to be so great though!

I really really REALLY miss being able to chain OS+FB+BB together. I'd do anything to have that back, lol. I also don't really understand how hotkeying a skill does more damage rather than the actual command form? Feels like it needs to be switched, IMO. I guess it seems like Arans went from having it's unique chaining/combo play-style to a generic mash two buttons class.

[quote=FreeIcecream]Those classes do have Magic Crash.[/quote]

I was saying it should stay a warrior exclusive but I realized that Mihile also has magic crash. Either way I think they should stay exclusive to those 4 classes.

[quote=Star909]Pretty sure Dark Knight, Hero, Mihile don't have binds. as for magic gaurd I think that should stay an explorer warrior exclusive.[/quote]

Those classes do have Magic Crash.

[quote=MapleBhav]Don't know if GMS can do anything about the changes unless the pass the message on to KMS, but if they do pass the message on. Lf>Bind/Magic Crash skill, I feel like we are the only warrior class without one. Also if drain could be like 5%max hp (kms) that would be nice.

Congratz on becoming the representative![/quote]

Pretty sure Dark Knight, Hero, Mihile don't have binds. as for magic gaurd I think that should stay an explorer warrior exclusive.

Don't know if GMS can do anything about the changes unless the pass the message on to KMS, but if they do pass the message on. Lf>Bind/Magic Crash skill, I feel like we are the only warrior class without one. Also if drain could be like 5%max hp (kms) that would be nice.

Congratz on becoming the representative!

I will list concerns as I am pro Aran as well.
1. Our rush skill should move us forward regardless of mobs being present or not.
2. The intermittent delay while using a key bound combat step should be decreased.
3. Final blow and beyonder should have a tiny bit more horizontal range, due to animation size.
4. I haven't thought about how well this would function but what if beyond blade could be held down to cast the three different stages, and the animation could be canceled by combat step or combo spin. (Similar to what they did with shades 'bomb punch')

Please reply back to give me your opinion on my ideas.

Thanks a lot for the feedback guys! I'll be putting together a google doc that I'll submit to the council with things I see here as well as my own suggestions, once I have some time.

@Raiden Would be best if CU functioned to set Tempest to pre nerf where it actually does lines of damage and has no cooldown. If thats not "balanced" enough they could just have it while CU is up the stacks on tempest don't apply and it'll cost 50 or 100(depending on your hyper skill build) combo each use for 30 seconds.

[quote=GiveLess]@Raiden I was looking at the changes to tempest and was wondering if it would still be spammable while under the effect of Combo Unlimited. If it isn't it would be nice for that to be added as I only every spam tempest while CU is active, was kind of the whole point of giving us a buff that lets us spam combo skills.[/quote]

That sounds pretty good - have it remove the cooldown of Tempest while it's up. It'll basically be the same thing as Demon Slayer's Boundless Rage + Demon Cry.

Can we even use tempest like we used to though? If it leaves all monsters with 1000 HP, will the second cast kill them?