Dark Knight nerfs on Kmst
So in [url=http://www.southperry.net/showthread.php?t=74284]the latest KMST patch[/url] a lot of classes are getting some rebalancing and dark knights got 3 nerfs.
- Beholder cooldown increased from 60 to 70 seconds
- Cross-surge damage increase reduced from 100% to 80%
- Sacrifice duration reduced from 40 to 30 seconds
If these changes hit the live servers you'll need over 100% buff duration for infinite gungnir which is going to be a pretty huge dps loss in long boss battles.
Thoughts?
July 10, 2014
37 Comments • Newest first
[quote=Singaporean]I don't see the point here. Drks have another skill to use while gungnir is on cooldown so doesn't seem to be a problem here.[/quote]
Not sure how this has anything to do with what I said.
Anyhow, I just reiterated the post I posted before that anyway, so a more in-depth explanation is there.
[quote=SombraManx]@Singaporean: nope, if they really needed to nerf infinite gungnir, they should at least increase the lines or/and damage %... and revamp dark impale too.. (since its ugly, and as weak as many third job skills)
now we get one with longer CD and longer cd behodler...[/quote]
Forgot about impale's %. Yeah, that needs an update.
@Singaporean am I the only one who's Dark Knight hit about 4x lower on each line than my Pally...
[quote=sugoisauce]such as how we weren't meant to solo bosses.[/quote]
Omg I agree with this completely. Dark Knights are strong, but we are incredibly reliant on a teammate when fighting bosses like Gollux. Not only does casting Beholder and Sacrifice make you completely vulnerable and useless for 2-3 seconds, but casting Gungnir itself is kind of clunky. I would rather buff Dimple to just under the average 1v1 skill tier, while making Gungnir something like a burst damage ultimate.
@Singaporean: nope, if they really needed to nerf infinite gungnir, they should at least increase the lines or/and damage %... and revamp dark impale too.. (since its ugly, and as weak as many third job skills)
now we get one with longer CD and longer cd behodler...
@SombraManx:
Okay and nexon's job is to try their best to balance the classes. Infinite gungnir is not balanced. Also, drk can still function quite well even with these changes.
@iVege:
I don't see the point here. Drks have another skill to use while gungnir is on cooldown so doesn't seem to be a problem here.
[quote=Singaporean]I don't get why people are super upset. So what? Drks surge got nerfed to 80%. That's not groundbreaking. Also, they stated themselves that they didn't want drks to just spam gungnir and now they can't. Basically, they felt unlimited gungnir was too good and no one here can argue with that. So... stop complaining.[/quote]
They stopped allowing Gungnir to be the sole skill used so [i]obviously[/i] that means they thought it was "too good".
[quote=Singaporean]I don't get why people are super upset. So what? Drks surge got nerfed to 80%. That's not groundbreaking. Also, they stated themselves that they didn't want drks to just spam gungnir and now they can't. Basically, they felt unlimited gungnir was too good and no one here can argue with that. So... stop complaining.[/quote]
is not what nexon wants, is what we want :v if people complain enough, these changes will never happen
I don't get why people are super upset. So what? Drks surge got nerfed to 80%. That's not groundbreaking. Also, they stated themselves that they didn't want drks to just spam gungnir and now they can't. Basically, they felt unlimited gungnir was too good and no one here can argue with that. So... stop complaining.
[quote=dashx4]This isn't as bad as what paladin's got.[/quote]
it is, but in a different way, paladins now absolutely suck damage wise, but at least they have some tricks (totally outdone by bishops except for bind and crash)
dark knights still have "OK" damage, totally outdone by heroes except "hurr durr we can heal ourselves" heroes can crash too.
so really, no reason to bring either to a boss run since there's better classes out there that do the same thing
and i always wondered why cross surge was 100%, why couldn't they make it 50% and last pact, you know, the 4th job skill, be 80%+20% from hyper.
same result, more sense
This isn't as bad as what paladin's got.
[quote=Momijii]Cross Surge [i]did[/i] give too much damage. 100% damage for staying at 100% HP on a class that doesn't have the hardest time staying full HP is silly. If anything though, it was more of a nerf in the direction of Phantoms.[/quote]
Cross Surge might as well have been a passive 100% damage boost and it would be alright as far as explorer warrior standings go. That is, even if the skill was too strong, it did not make DrKs so. If it was too much for a single skill, and a third job one at that, then it could've been split up.
Cross Surge's nerf has around the same amount of impact for both classes afaic. Given reasoning implies Dark Knights were the ones in mind.
[quote=Momijii]That was their point? They said they didn't like that ultimately DrKs boiled down to getting enough Buff Duration and then just spamming Gunghir. Sacrifice and Gunghir combined with enough buff duration had the unintended consequence of making Dark Knights strong. Nerfing Sacrifice has the semi-unintended consequence of making Dark Knights weaker. Though you'll still be pretty strong anyways.[/quote]
No, it wasn't their point. Nothing suggests that Sacrifice+Gungnir+BD resulting in more damage was an "unintended consequence". The problem was that Gungnir was conceptualised to be a burst damage skill that you could only use some of the time. Buff duration made that all of the time (well, not if you want Hex, which just questions the legitimacy of this apparent issue in the first place). In other words, they had to break the full cycle in some way. But with their reasoning, if they wanted to be fair, they would have kept the Dark Knight's damage output the same (minus Cross Surge nerf), while fixing Gungnir's intended concept. In other words, buff the class to compensate for the loss of damage that resulted from the fixing of Gungnir's concept.
I'm assuming you interpreted their reasoning as, "we did not expect buff duration to be exploited to make Gungnir deal more damage so we will nerf those two skills." If the unintended consequence was really just DrKs becoming strong, then they could have just nerfed Gungnir. It was not a matter of damage, but corruption of intended concept. You link this issue directly with "more damage", but there was no need to and that was how you failed to come to a mutual understanding with my previous post.
[quote=Momijii]Why don't they get buffs like Bowmasters? Bowmasters were weak. Simple as that. The other part would be that Dark Knights were as I mentioned earlier, semi-unintentionally made weaker (thus left out of a buff cycle).
If it makes you feel any better, Heroes got buffed for the umptillionth time and Paladins were essentially gutted.[/quote]
I didnt want buffs for DrKs, just fixes to glitches and what not. And calling Bowmasters weak is just wrong. Even before taking into account Armour Break's broken effect, they are not weak even if weaker than DrKs. They could have pulled through as is, and giving them Blaster's damage while having Hurricane's mobility was just a nice bonus for those who didn't have the control to use Blaster effectively. Of course, they were still buffed regardless due to being "too weak". I welcome the buff to their mobbing (with the buff to their bossing being smaller due to Hurricane being a bit slower and about on-par with Blaster), but they were already better than Marksmen on low mobs iirc. Plus, I am told they are already better than Marksmen at bossing due to Armour Break. That Bowmasters now have better, mobile bossing, better mobbing in the more frequent low numbers and a higher cap despite all that, while Marksmen receive no changes, is a bit disconcerting.
Not sure how Heroes being buffed is supposed to make me happy. I don't even care much for the warrior scene anymore.
[quote=iVege]Not sure how that could make someone laugh.
Oh, and apparently the reasons for these changes was because they didn't like how Gungnir could be spammed with 50% buff duration, and that Cross Surge gave "way too much damage". The latter is barely a reason, but fine, we'll take your word for it.
The former, however, is just downright retarded. Why would they stop always-on Sacrifice by just nerfing the skill? They're pretty much nerfing the whole class just so Gungnir won't be spammed 100% of the time. Don't they need to buff the class like they did for Bowmasters to compensate for the changes?
Of course, unless this reasoning was just one big fat lie and they just missed hating on Drks.[/quote]
Cross Surge [i]did[/i] give too much damage. 100% damage for staying at 100% HP on a class that doesn't have the hardest time staying full HP is silly. If anything though, it was more of a nerf in the direction of Phantoms.
That was their point? They said they didn't like that ultimately DrKs boiled down to getting enough Buff Duration and then just spamming Gunghir. Sacrifice and Gunghir combined with enough buff duration had the unintended consequence of making Dark Knights strong. Nerfing Sacrifice has the semi-unintended consequence of making Dark Knights weaker. Though you'll still be pretty strong anyways. Why don't they get buffs like Bowmasters? Bowmasters were weak. Simple as that. The other part would be that Dark Knights were as I mentioned earlier, semi-unintentionally made weaker (thus left out of a buff cycle).
If it makes you feel any better, Heroes got buffed for the umptillionth time and Paladins were essentially gutted.
Once i got to 200 on my drk i stopped using it so i dont care, but yeah drks are way op right now
[quote=hidoshi94]what the ...?
you made me laugh so hard, thank you very much xD[/quote]
Not sure how that could make someone laugh.
Oh, and apparently the reasons for these changes was because they didn't like how Gungnir could be spammed with 50% buff duration, and that Cross Surge gave "way too much damage". The latter is barely a reason, but fine, we'll take your word for it.
The former, however, is just downright retarded. Why would they stop always-on Sacrifice by just nerfing the skill? They're pretty much nerfing the whole class just so Gungnir won't be spammed 100% of the time. Don't they need to buff the class like they did for Bowmasters to compensate for the changes?
Of course, unless this reasoning was just one big fat lie and they just missed hating on Drks.
[quote=SombraManx]i dont really care, im from venezuela and I lag so effing bad that I have 100% gungnir all the time even with 0% buff duration increase[/quote]
what the ...?
you made me laugh so hard, thank you very much xD
Took them effing long enough. Lol
Still batman, still good.
your tears are delicious.
At least they make changes to your class lol
i dont really care, im from venezuela and I lag so effing bad that I have 100% gungnir all the time even with 0% buff duration increase
FYI if you've been reading other forum sites, there's a lot of speculation of 5th job
The changes to a lot of classes was to prepare classes to finish 4th job by 140 (There's an explanation on the new sp gains on sp in kms extractions)
Chances are, classes (including ours) will get stronger through 5th job
Overall, it's suppose to start gearing towards balancing classes.
hope we don't go to sht like pre-red
I'll admit, the buffs earlier were overpowering (I went on hiatus for 2 months after the patch for that reason because everything felt too easy) On the other hand, a few other classes get buffs and nerfs so I'm sorta happy that we're not the only one. I hope everything balances out so that even the worse class is either not that far from the strongest damage dealing class or very useful in other aspects of the game.
[quote=TTBlueRabbit135]Don't know why they are thinking... Why are they nerfing classes but buffing up mobs HP.[/quote]
because everyone with more than 10$ funding 1shots everything up until 165 and drk is broken/overpowered.
Sounds like I need to get back my inner buff duration back.
Hopefully it won't be this big of a hit when it gets to the real servers. If it is, that'll be bad x.x
[quote=VietUA]@xdwow: That's like me demanding Nexon to change Arrow Blaster's color: Never going to happen.[/quote]
Well they did.
Maybe just not the colour you wanted it to be.
@xdwow: That's like me demanding Nexon to change Arrow Blaster's color: Never going to happen.
[quote=VietUA]@xdwow: Well, why don't we just give all classes ranged attacks [/quote]
Why not? Kaiser is too nuub I demand no CD inferno breath pls.
@xdwow: Well, why don't we just give all classes ranged attacks
[quote=VietUA]>holds a spear
>slams magic spear onto enemies from a far distance
I'm sure this won't be too bad[/quote]
FYI, it's Odin's magical spear.
>holds a spear
>slams magic spear onto enemies from a far distance
I'm sure this won't be too bad
@TTBlueRabbit135:
It's not harder. More and more people are getting stronger aka funded and thus they need game content to accommodate them. Gear is also easy to buy in the fm and there's guides on how to make money as to quickly fund yourself.
[quote=Singaporean]Uhhh I dunno... maybe it's because most people are trashing mobs with ease now?[/quote]
Really, looks like they are making it even more harder for unfunded to kill.
[quote=TTBlueRabbit135]Don't know why they are thinking... Why are they nerfing classes but buffing up mobs HP.[/quote]
Uhhh I dunno... maybe it's because most people are trashing mobs with ease now?
Don't know why they are thinking... Why are they nerfing classes but buffing up mobs HP.
As much as I love seeing people other than myself crying, I doubt this'll happen. It'll be less damage-reducing, but probably some kind of nerf.