General

Yeah, finding an arts related job nowadays is hard but just remember that getting a science/math degree without doing a half-assed job at your occupation isn't easy either. Oops, forgot to mention the drop out/change programs rate too; I hope people aren't all talk as they claim to be as well as having a social life. Also, do dare to say the same thing to someone majoring in the foreign languages area because there's a growing demand for them since language is dying in the world. Just saying.

The harsh truth is that some degrees are more or less worthless because society doesn't have as much demand for them.

[quote=2lazy2makeaname]so....mind helping me with statics sometimes? ^_^[/quote]
PM me with questions whenever you like. No guarantees though, since I don't remember everything (though I vividly recall hating the 3D part).

[quote=Amuro]Oh, sorry... the morning me took you literally. I do math and physics too (more statics than dynamics though, since concrete can't grow legs and run).[/quote]

so....mind helping me with statics sometimes? ^_^

[quote=7hdog]Hence my witty comment. Enginere, enginer, enginyr, I do math and physics (and maybe thermodynamics).[/quote]
Oh, sorry... the morning me took you literally. I do math and physics too (more statics than dynamics though, since concrete can't grow legs and run).

One of my more successful friends who has a car, a place of his own, and $20,000 in savings is a communications studies major lol.

All my engineering friends are overworked, stressed, and in heaps of debt that they won't be able to pay off for who knows how long.

There is a lot more that determines your outcome in life than what you major in. A lot of engineers are overworked and underpaid, the ones who have non-stressful high paying jobs are in management positions.

i have a friend with a bachelor's in graphic design and she cant find a job
her twin sister however is a nurse or doctor and is currently employed

[quote=Kezini]English teachers that could not pursue their passions and tumblr famous?[/quote]

You should probably learn what liberal arts before talking about it, it's not just literature and drama lol...

Haven't heard that one before.

It's quite ignorant of people to downplay the value of psychology, sociology, philosophy, political science, etc. 1st world contemporary societies would not be the same without them.

I'm a digital media major. Can I get... uh... bread scraps, please?

YOU DON'T LIKE PICKLES?
screw you.

@ulti25 Completely agreed.

I knew my fair share of Civs who were sick of it all by 2nd/3rd year. Some switched majors, and others are dragging themselves to the finish line, motivated only by the fact that they're almost done. Being in engineering alone shouldn't earn anyone's respect, because both the program and the profession make no promise that you will be awesome and likeable. The education and the degree are keys, and it's not a good idea to draw conclusions about any individual based on their keys alone.

We've had numerous guest speakers from the industry telling us that they learned more relevant things in their first 4 months of work than in their 4 years of university. Many senior engineers have spiels about how the work they did at school as nonsense that didn't prepare them for what was ahead. Time management, learning how to learn, listening well and taking good notes - these are some of the more useful things I've taken away from engineering, and they aren't specifically related to engineering at all. Any motivated person could take those things away from any program.

People relating art students to burger flippers is as infuriating as people seeing engineers as bitter and condescending work slaves. Both are sweeping generalizations, and both demonstrate a lack of understanding of where skills and personal + academic experience can take you.

[quote=7hdog]I assume you're pursuing a fashion/liberal arts degree. Correct what you wrote, it is putrid garbage that cannot be seen by future-engineers.

Is referring to grammar. tee-hee[/quote]

My grammar? There's nothing incorrect with my grammar other than archaic Jane Eyre-esque sentence structure than your numb-founded mind probably can't recognize. Let's take a moment to look at your grammar:

You on, the other hand, created a run on sentence by assuming a comma meant you could connect two statements. You're mistaken! You're better off typing:

Correct what you wrote; it is putrid garbage that cannot be seen by future-engineers.
or
Correct what you wrote. It is putrid garbage that cannot be seen by future-engineers.
or
I'm an idiot.

Also, your ironic ending sentence is poor and annoying due to starting the sentence off with 'is' which makes your sentence poorly structured.

Please, please, please reconsider your choices before you try to use your engineering mind to correct anybody.

Lastly, I'm a double Sociology and Media Studies major. That falls under Social Sciences (Not as if that helps).

People aren't really defined by their major more than their capabilities and disposition. I'm in my third year in ChemE and I've seen both genuinely smart people and either burnt-out or just dull people. I'd imagine it's the same everywhere, regardless of major. Now, from what I've observed:

Obviously factors such as location, networking, luck, initiative, and actual field of study all come into play, but you'd be surprised at what type of jobs some engineers actually get into. There's a lot of jobs directed more for technicians that overqualified engineers have to get into. Engineering school is tough, but the industry is much different than school. You leave school (supposedly/ideally) with a solid foundation, that's about it. When you get into the industry, you're going to pretty much trash 60-70% (if not more) of what you learned in school and start specializing in whatever sub-field you go into.

You'd be surprised at how some of the training manuals for these types of jobs look like. A friend showed me one a couple of weeks ago where they bothered to explain what temperature is and went through basic dimensional analysis and units conversion. There are jobs held by engineers that require genuine intelligence and creativity, but I'd be reluctant to say that there's a lot of those jobs laying around.

With this point of view in mind, engineering isn't that much different than a lot of liberal arts studies. A lot of people (pay to) study liberal arts (which is more than drawing/painting, even math is considered a liberal art) for the networking opportunities. I'd imagine that after you get into that grueling first entry-level job as an engineer, all you really have left to do is to grit through it and start making friends and understanding the bigger picture of your specialization to go higher and higher. As you go up the ladder, it becomes more and more business. Pure science is also very much the same. Scientific research requires money, and funding is just business and politics. While the subjects are interesting, a lot of people end up being lab rats or code monkeys.

A lot of people in engineering actually go into it to have either a sort of fail-safe back up or as a stepping stone into higher research-oriented professions.
Also it's kind of funny (and by that I mean enraging) seeing people who can't into pre-calculus call themselves engineers and condescend others.

@TheAngery1 I think I'm going to vomit my breakfast. Here are some facts for you:

1. Let me start my correcting you. The "hate" for art students is concocted by engineering students. The main reasons for it are as simple as: job prospects in arts programs aren't as good, and the degree itself doesn't open any doors for getting into that technical part of society, where one can help to improve the lives of future generations. Engineers are logical, and engineering is seen as a safe route that pays off reasonably well.

Most of the hate towards art students isn't deep rooted or serious. We vocalize our hate and they vocalize it right back at us, but deep down, engineers can appreciate that everyone has different strengths and values, and that without art students, society would be pretty darn boring. We play video games, we watch movies, we buy clothes, and so on and so forth, and the older you get, the more the appreciate the people behind all of those things.

2. By 4th year, everyone in engineering knows the pay isn't phenomenal. Most engineers use their degree and their engineering experience as a stepping stone for bigger things.

3. Most people have some gripes about their job. If everybody was happy with their what they did, then the average number of jobs a person has in his or her lifetime these days would be 1-2, not 5-8.

What makes engineering interesting is that there's variety in what you do, and the outcome is the result of your ingenuity or (lack thereof). I don't care who payed for a building to be built. If it's built well and it works well, it's because of the engineers. Of course, not everyone knows what they're going into, and the result is that they complain about the bad but can't see the good (possibly like your engineering friends).

You can call engineers whatever the heck you want, but it makes you sound arrogant and close-minded. As logical as I am, even I can appreciate that not everything can come your way, and that there's more to life than work.

[quote=LazyLazyLazy]I don't know what is Liberal Arts? If they can't find employment besides McDonald, they should just be self-employed and work on projects with funded grants. They have to be self-starters that can make use of their whatever knowledge from that major and stuff stuff.[/quote]

liberal arts is social science- so like anything involving with people.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_science

@7hdog Funny, because what's really putrid is how terrible the grammar is of most engineers in my program. (That sentence probably wasn't grammatically correct...)

@TheAngery1 Oh, I didn't know we had someone in Basil Market with enough experience with engineering to make those generalizations. (Please don't elaborate, because you're wrong.)

The amount of underage posters who don't know what their talking about on this thread is literally eating away at my soul.

Engineers just about everywhere in Canada are taught to hate on art students at frosh. It's not a mindset I'd adopt, and it's not the art students' fault that there's such a rift in post-secondary education and beyond.

Business is sort of a weird one. It isn't a technical major but it usually isn't classified as a liberal arts major. What it is, is a major that's useful for climbing the ladder. Even though engineering is difficult and prestigious and all that good stuff, the big money in engineering is in project management, where business management knowledge is mandatory (obviously).

I don't know what is Liberal Arts? If they can't find employment besides McDonald, they should just be self-employed and work on projects with funded grants. They have to be self-starters that can make use of their whatever knowledge from that major and stuff stuff.

[quote=Hatchet]Art students should do something useful in this world.[/quote]

they do, it's called taking my order.

[quote=metaghost4]Maybe we Computer Scientist majors wouldn't be like that if you guys didn't give me a small combo when I paid for a large.[/quote]
Computer science: it's not really a math, not exactly a science, isn't an engineering major, and takes less work than EE yet potentially pays more.

tfw you switch your major to CS and everyone in your discrete math and calc 3 class laugh at you for not being an engineering major
tfw by the time you learn how to properly use GUIs, EE/CE majors are making solar panels and can do 3D modeling
tfw everyone complains that majoring in CS is for failing/lazy engineering majors

Art students should do something useful in this world.

[quote=xFaceIess]oh. If you work at mcdonalds, can you like, ask them to put a vegetarian burger on the menu?
'cause like, y'know, i'm a vegetarian.
ITSNOTFAIR
I WANT ABURGEEEER. :C[/quote]

you chose to be a vegetarian, you knew this would happen

[quote=NoNsensical]Hi, I'm an engineering major. I'd like a venti iced Americano.[/quote]
Engineers ftw.

Most engineering jobs are needed in a lot of companies, and no body ever doubts your contribution unless you suck at your job.

By the way what is the difference between computer scientists and Software engineers. I'm studying software engineering in a university and I don't see a difference.
Anyone care to point out?

I like the arts but I would never major in arts.

oh. If you work at mcdonalds, can you like, ask them to put a vegetarian burger on the menu?
'cause like, y'know, i'm a vegetarian.
ITSNOTFAIR
I WANT ABURGEEEER. :C

[quote=Alcides]It's amazing how idiotic some of you basilers can be. Are any of you arts-bashing individuals even in college yet..? ..or are you just over achieving high schoolers who think you know everything there is to know about college before you've even reached it?[/quote]

Yep, finished biomedicine, in optometry. Mocha please.

[quote=Alcides]It's amazing how idiotic some of you basilers can be. Are any of you arts-bashing individuals even in college yet..? ..or are you just over achieving high schoolers who think you know everything there is to know about college before you've even reached it?[/quote]

Hi, I'm an engineering major. I'd like a venti iced Americano.

It's amazing how idiotic some of you basilers can be. Are any of you arts-bashing individuals even in college yet..? ..or are you just over achieving high schoolers who think you know everything there is to know about college before you've even reached it?

The way I see it, the liberal arts majors are the soulful elfs full of wisdom and loveliness and everyone else is split into the barbaric human and orc divisions. <3

this is too funny and true.

[quote=eean]sometimes I really want to know what people think "liberal arts" implies

I go to a liberal arts school that has plenty of STEM majors and a surprisingly reputable meteorology program. "Liberal arts" to me just means small classes and a more diverse course load[/quote]

thank you.

[quote=Kezini]English teachers that could not pursue their passions and tumblr famous?[/quote]

You could use a bit of this liberal arts education.

[quote=tiesandbowties]You do realize a liberal arts education goes beyond the expertise of those jobs you listed right?[/quote]

I'm pretty sure they think liberal arts is drawing stuff...

[quote=tiesandbowties]You do realize a liberal arts education goes beyond the expertise of those jobs you listed right?[/quote]

English teachers that could not pursue their passions and tumblr famous?

[quote=asslicking]Please don't hate on Arts students. Art school graduates provide a valuable service to the community - without them we would not have baristas, flight attendants, or clothing retailers.[/quote]

You do realize a liberal arts education goes beyond the expertise of those jobs you listed right?

[quote=asslicking]Please don't hate on Arts students. Art school graduates provide a valuable service to the community - without them we would not have baristas, flight attendants, or clothing retailers.[/quote]

This. I like my Starbucks.

You work at McDonalds now?

or the lunch special at pizza hut